Environment Committee on June 4th, 2024

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac, QC]

Is their role to collect the best practices out there? I'm not asking only about Canada, because we are international partners participating in the OECD forum, the UN forum and the World Bank forum. Everybody is talking about climate change and the importance of water, so finding, identifying, applying and suggesting best practices in various fields.... Agriculture is one of them.

Do you think that would be a role to play?

[Sean Ledgerwood]

It could be—it's going to be different in different regions of the country—just so as long as it's specific to the province they're talking about at the time. Agriculture in the Prairies is not the same as agriculture in P.E.I., so it has to be based on the specific—

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thank you.

Ms. Pauzé, you have two minutes.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Ledgerwood, you are no doubt familiar with the federal-provincial-territorial committee on drinking water, which issued its recommendations in 2024.

Do you agree with these recommendations? Do you intend to introduce regulations to achieve the objectives of these recommendations?

[Sean Ledgerwood]

We take any recommendations seriously. We would look at them and see if they fit our unique situation. I don't know if there is a broad answer for that, but we would look at any recommendations and see if we can incorporate them or not.

Does that answer your question?

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

I'd like to know what your priorities are.

I asked a question about infrastructure earlier. As we know, everything is connected. Is coming up with better regulations a priority for you? Is protecting biodiversity one of your priorities?

Mr. Khan could answer my question, if he wishes.

[Haseen Khan]

I think our first priority, speaking from a Newfoundland and Labrador perspective, is to address the gaps in data and in monitoring networks, because they provide the basis for whatever work we do, whether we develop policies, best management practices or standard operating protocols. I think that is the first action. We would like to have monitoring networks providing coverage to all parts of the country.

Once that has been done, we would certainly like to see how we can develop best management practices and tools, such as flood risk management, to respond and adapt to climate change.

I would say the first priority is data, the second priority is policies and the third priority is to work as a team.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Pauzé.

Ms. Idlout, welcome to the committee. You have two minutes.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Qujannamiik, Iksivautaq. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for sharing information with us.

I would like to ask both witnesses to respond here. How are the effects of climate change, such as flood risks, considered when dealing with waste water? For example, during the 2013 Calgary floods, raw sewage ended up in the Bow River because the waste-water plant was flooded. Calgary has an incredible water treatment and waste-water plant, but disasters still happen.

What are your provinces doing to prepare for such disasters?

[Haseen Khan]

What we are doing is that, for all infrastructures that are designed now and that come for regulatory approval, we make sure that the climate change lens has been incorporated into the design of those infrastructures. That is the first thing we are doing. As you mentioned, we have learned from experience that the infrastructures designed and built 30 or 40 years ago did not take climate change into consideration. That's why in many of our communities those infrastructures are failing.

It's a two-stage process. First, on the infrastructure that is already there, we have to upgrade that slowly and gradually to meet climate change conditions. Any new infrastructure that we consider for approval should be in compliance with climate change conditions.

[Sean Ledgerwood]

We're much like Newfoundland and kind of in the same boat. Every decision we make and everything we build now has a climate change lens. We have climate change, sort of, mini-experts in all our departments across the government. We're incorporating that now, just like Haseen said.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thanks very much. That's good.

Mr. Kram, you have four minutes, please.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for joining us today.

I've often wondered about this. Provinces like Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland are surrounded by the Atlantic Ocean and therefore have unlimited access to water, except it's salt water. Have either of your provincial governments ever studied the possibility of desalination facilities to acquire drinking water and other uses of water from the ocean so that changes in river flows in any one year don't make that much difference?

Is that something that has ever been studied in any great depth?

[Haseen Khan]

The cost of converting sea-water into acceptable drinking water is very high. Our focus is to make use of our freshwater resources.

But yes, we have been considering the impact, especially, as you said, since 70% of our population lives in coastal areas. With climate change, the sea level is rising. We have been considering how that rise in sea level is impacting our groundwater wells, which are being used as a source of drinking water in coastal communities, because that raises the issue of saltwater intrusion. We are trying to develop policies so that we can optimize the pumpage of water in order to minimize the pumpage of salt water into those wells.

This is an aspect that has been looked into and that has been both modelled as well as monitored, but we have not looked into using sea-water as a source of drinking water for cost-benefit reasons.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Mr. Ledgerwood.

[Sean Ledgerwood]

We haven't focused, or not that I'm aware of, on saltwater desalination. We have a very plentiful aquifer, and our priority is to protect that aquifer. We have quite a bit of water. It's not limitless, but at this point we have a good quantity that serves the needs of the islanders. Our focus is on protecting that and not so much about desalination, at this point.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Okay.

The committee has discussed at length a possible future mandate for the Canada water agency. One of the proposals that has come up is a cost-sharing model for major infrastructure projects. We had witnesses before from Saskatchewan to talk about the Lake Diefenbaker project.

Are there similar major projects on the drawing board in your provinces that could benefit from this cost-sharing model?

[Sean Ledgerwood]

I don't think there's anything major. You talk about a large, large scale. That wouldn't be our scale at all. As I've harped on several times already, we'd like to upgrade our aging infrastructure. That's where we see the most benefit right now.

[Haseen Khan]

[Inaudible—Editor] in two categories.

One is the infrastructure upgrades or rehabilitation. For that, cost-share programs would be highly beneficial. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, our infrastructure is aging, and we have to invest in that infrastructure.

The second is technical guidance on how we can operate and maintain that infrastructure and what tools we can develop, such as flood forecasting models. National guidance on how we can manage areas that have been designated as flood plains is the most pressing issue.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thank you.

We'll go now to Mr. Ali for four minutes.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Chair, I want to share my time with my colleague Mike Morrice. I think he might have some questions to ask.

To Sean Ledgerwood, the acting manager of water and air monitoring at the Department of Environment, Energy and Climate Action, first of all, thank you so much for being here today and enlightening us with your knowledge.

In your view, what role can the Canada water agency have in Prince Edward Island's context?

[Sean Ledgerwood]

I'll go back to providing research, providing expertise and really giving us knowledge where we don't have the expertise, providing some of that and providing policies that would benefit and be useful for P.E.I. and that would be adaptable to P.E.I..

Those are the two main priorities for us.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

What role do you believe the Canada water agency can have in ensuring that we're prepared for the impacts that climate change is having on our freshwater resources?

[Sean Ledgerwood]

As I said, our climate change department is very aggressive with adaptation, and by having our department collaborate with experts in the field, the water agency may be able to provide and use that expertise to complement our program, complement our adaptation, going forward.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thanks.

Mr. Khan, thank you for being here. I'll ask you the same question.

What role do you believe the Canada water agency can have in Newfoundland and Labrador's context?