That's a point of debate. I see it as relevant.
Thank you for the opportunity to thank the witnesses for being here.
We're going to have to stop the panel. We were almost done anyway. It was a fascinating discussion, I must say. We really appreciate all of you being here and sharing your time and your thoughts on this issue. I think we've all learned a great deal. Thank you very much. We'll now go to this debate on future business. Again, thank you for being with us.
Mr. van Koeverden, go ahead and continue.