Evidence of meeting #136 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was tax.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
—that additional policies are needed for the highest-emitting sectors, such as oil and gas and transportation.
Liberal
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
Maybe I'll pick up there.
Each sector has its unique context. One of the unique contexts of the oil and gas sector is that they are making record profits. They are raking in billions of dollars. This government still seems comfortable handing out money to this sector while saying that they need to do less than other sectors. It's concerning.
Ms. Stewart, I don't hold you responsible for that. You are not crafting the climate policy. You are our ambassador. Like my colleagues before me, I am concerned that Canada has maintained its position of 62nd in this year's Climate Change Performance Index. We are rated as very low in the ratings for GHG emissions, for renewable energy and for energy use categories. Again, that's not something that I hold you personally responsible for; that's something that I want the government to step up and change their policies on.
My questions for you today are really about this new context that we're in. Canadians are rightly concerned about Trump's recent electoral win and what it means for future climate policy. Project 2025 has laid out a pretty clear plan to undo the environmental protection act. I am concerned about what it will do to undermine the Inflation Reduction Act pieces and what this means for the Paris Agreement.
From your perspective, given Trump's tariff threats and his rejection of climate science, and given that America is Canada's largest trading partner, what can the Canadian government do to reduce emissions with the urgency needed while remaining economically competitive in this new context of a Trump presidency?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
Thank you to the honourable member for her question.
When it comes to the transition in administration in the U.S., there is a team set up within government that crosses many government departments and that is analyzing and anticipating the changes that will come with the new administration. I don't want to speculate, and won't speculate right now, on what those changes will be and what that means. I will just let you know that there is a team in place looking at all of that and talking about responding to eventualities when they happen. I don't engage in that a lot in my current role.
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
Has it changed at all? Has your team been planning at all for that shift? Have there been conversations with this government team, or has your team been doing any work in preparation for the transition?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I think a lot of my engagement is in plurilateral and multilateral settings. There are still many countries that are very committed to climate action and that want to hear from Canada.
To your earlier point about the fossil fuel sector, there is a genuine interest in hearing about Canada's experience and what we're doing. We'll continue to push on that and the policies that we are advancing.
We recognize the urgency of action and the need to engage globally and work on it together with global partners. We continue to have lots of global partners that want to work with us. That's the way I look at it as I do my forward planning.
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
One thing that came up at a number of the previous different COPs, including COP29, was the presence of oil and gas lobbyists and how the industry has played a big role at these conferences.
Do you see it as a conflict or contradictory that 28 Canadian delegates have ties to the oil and gas sector, when the goal of COP is really to reduce our global emissions and this sector is disproportionately responsible for those increasing emissions?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I think from Canada's perspective, when it comes to our delegation for COP, we aim to have an inclusive and diverse delegation, because we believe everybody needs to be at the table. Everybody needs to be involved in the solution.
Provinces and territories put forward the representatives that they want to see on our delegation. We, as a federal government, pay for indigenous representatives and youth and civil society to come, because we feel their voice is very important, but there are also members of Parliament who come, and senators and so on.
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
I wanted to focus specifically on the oil and gas industry representatives.
Given their large numbers and the kind of disproportionate role that they play in these conferences and have in COPs in the past, and probably will in COPs in the future, do you think the COP might achieve bolder agreements if we didn't have that kind of disproportionate representation from this industry?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I think COP outcomes are what parties agree to, and I would just underscore that at COP28 last year, over 190 parties agreed to language that notes the need to transition away from fossil fuels in the energy sector, so we were able to accomplish quite a bit. Many countries, as they're preparing their climate plans, know what they need to do based on that outcome last year.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Thank you very much.
We'll go to our second round. I'll make it a four-minute and two-minute round because we're a little short of time.
Mr. Deltell, you have the floor for four minutes.
Conservative
Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Good morning, colleagues.
Ambassador, I would like to pay my respects.
You're appearing before this parliamentary committee virtually today, and that's a very good thing. Why are you testifying here virtually when you've made more than 30 trips in the past two years, at a very high environmental cost?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I am based in Switzerland. My spouse is posted here from Global Affairs Canada and I'm here as an accompanying spouse, so I didn't feel it was necessary to pay the cost to fly to Canada for this committee appearance, and I do take lots of virtual meetings in the course of my role as well.
Conservative
Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC
Okay, but the problem is that you visited five continents. You've travelled everywhere and the environmental footprint is very heavy. By the way, you are participating very correctly. I'd rather you were here virtually than cross the Atlantic twice to talk about the environment.
Why didn't you meet virtually more often instead of travelling 30 times? Your trips cost taxpayers over $250,000.
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I do take many virtual meetings as well as engage in person. As Canada's climate ambassador, I have been asked to represent Canada internationally, so that is why I travel. It is part of my role. I take that responsibility very seriously. That's why I would like to turn to the chief financial officer, who is in the room and who can speak to the rules and the directives that I follow in my role.
Conservative
Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC
You say that you take this very personally. That's very good, and I commend you for that.
We talked earlier about the $250,000, according to the National Post. What's your environmental bill for travelling more than 30 times across five continents? What did you personally pay in terms of the environment for those trips that you could have done otherwise?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
I would like to turn to our chief financial officer to also speak about public servants and the offsets that are made for public travel of public servants, please.
Conservative
Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC
Can you explain to me why, when you were in Canada, you travelled from Toronto to Ottawa, back and forth, by plane, when you could have taken the train and demonstrated your commitment to the environment?
Ambassador for Climate Change, Department of the Environment
When I am invited to be somewhere, I do look at all the options, and sometimes it makes more sense.... Air travel, as you know, is faster than the train, but certainly I do take this responsibility very seriously.
Conservative
Liberal
Liberal
Leah Taylor Roy Liberal Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON
I'm wondering about the relevance of this line of questioning to the purported purpose for which we have these officials here. Rather than grilling them on their specific choices on transportation methods, I think we have some rather larger policy issues that we should be addressing.
Don't you agree, Mr. Deltell?