Evidence of meeting #46 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amendment.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
I call the meeting to order.
Good afternoon. I'd like to welcome Mr. Zimmer, who's joining our committee today for clause-by-clause of Bill S-5.
We have with us again Mr. Carreau, Ms. Farquharson and Madam Gonçalves.
(On clause 16.1)
I'm just going to take a minute to situate myself. I believe, G-12 had been tabled, so it's on the floor. We're opening the discussion on it. Would anyone like to speak to G-12?
Do you have your hand up, Ms. Collins?
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
I do. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
In our last meeting I had proposed a subamendment. After speaking to members of the committee, I don't have support for the subamendment. In the interest of time, I'm not going to move it.
I can speak more maybe after other members of the committee speak.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Okay.
Would anyone like to speak to this amendment?
Mr. Weiler.
Liberal
Patrick Weiler Liberal West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to propose a subamendment to this amendment.
Currently, the amendment says:
The Ministers shall, to the extent practicable, use scientifically justified alternative methods and strategies to replace, reduce or refine the use of vertebrate animals in the generation of data and the conduct of investigations under paragraph 68(a).
Then proposed subsection (2) would say, “For the purposes of subsection (1), methods and strategies to refine the use of vertebrate animals”. Here I want to strike “shall” and add “include minimizing”, and then from there it continues “pain and distress caused to vertebrate animals in the generation of data and the conduct of investigations under paragraph 68(a).”
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Can you send it in writing to the clerk? It can't be distributed to everyone, because it's not bilingual, as far as I know. The clerks would like to see a written version.
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
In the meantime, after you've done that, of course, we can open discussion on the subamendment.
We have Ms. Collins, please.
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
I appreciate the intent of this motion in general. I think the addition is valuable, and I think the addition of the subamendment is also valuable.
I will be voting in favour of the subamendment but, in the end, voting against the amendment, just because it is deleting an important section about what the minister shall not do and really taking out some of the checkpoints and the requirements to answer this question each time.
I really appreciate the additions that are being added here, and I appreciate the work of both Ms. Taylor Roy and Mr. Weiler.
Liberal
Leah Taylor Roy Liberal Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON
I just want to comment on that.
I did meet with some of the animal rights groups—Animal Justice and Dr. Chandrasekera—after the last meeting to discuss this. They're satisfied with this. It has the positive intent of advocating for increased use of non-animal testing to support that kind of research and development in that area.
On the subamendment that Mr. Weiler just made, it also addressed the issue of “refine”, which some people want to remove and some want to include, but it just tried to tailor that to specify that it was only talking about basically reducing pain when it came to the refinements.
I do think this amendment is very much supported by the animal rights activists. I would hope that people will support this as well.
Thank you.
Conservative
Damien Kurek Conservative Battle River—Crowfoot, AB
Thank you, Chair.
I know that the subamendment was read into the record and there was talk about it being sent. I am just wondering if we can have the exact wording read again. Thank you.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Don't you have it yet? Has it been sent directly?
Okay, we'll get it to you in a second.
February 2nd, 2023 / 3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Absolutely.
As we wait for the written text to arrive, does anyone else want to speak to it?
Ms. Pauzé, go ahead.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
Since the text that was sent is not in French, could Mr. Weiler reread it?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
I am being told that it's bilingual. So you will be able to read the French version.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
The text will be sent in both official languages to all the committee members by email.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
Mr. Chair, I would like to put a question to the person who made this proposal.
There are restrictions, but I am wondering why it is also proposed to remove all the restrictions. I am trying to read the exceptions and the amendment side by side, and it seems to me that it could work.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
No, it is an amendment by replacement, so all the exceptions would also end up being removed.
Liberal
Bloc
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
We are now debating the subamendment. You should receive the text of the subamendment by email.
Ms. Taylor Roy, do you want to elaborate on the amendment?