Environment Committee on Nov. 21st, 2023

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

She did.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Yes, but she's not the chair.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

You have two lists [Inaudible—Editor]

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Yes, but just in terms of precedence, last time Mr. Deltell said the same thing—that he was on the clerk's list—but I didn't see him and I didn't let him speak. I want to be consistent.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Anyway, I'd like to ask if the witnesses would be willing to come back on another occasion.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Mr. Chair, that's not fair to the witnesses.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

I understand that it's not fair.

[An hon. member]

If we deal with it—

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay, but I'm saying that's if we can deal with it.

Mr. Leslie, go ahead. You have the floor.

[Branden Leslie, Conservative, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would just highlight that the interruptions and points of order have taken much more time than I was planning to use to speak to this.

I am unaware of any threats to any senators. I, of course, in no way would ever condone physical harassment or threats. It certainly did not come from me. When I speak about a “march”, that is a typical protest that happens in front of Parliament Hill every day. It is not a threatening march to go attack senators.

However, the reason that people are here and angry is that this chamber, the House of Commons, passed a piece of legislation that would solve an affordability crisis for Canadians and would help farmers deal with increasing costs.

The reality is that natural gas and propane for grain drying and heating and for cooling of barns should have been exempted originally. Had the government been more aware of farming operations, they would have exempted that to begin with, just as they did for diesel and dyed fuel. We had a chance.

We have a chance. This chamber passed Bill C-234 with the support of the NDP, Conservatives, Bloc Québécois, Greens and some Liberals.

Mr. Chair, these are thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars of costs. They go directly against the bottom line of Canadian farmers. That ensures that their families have less prosperity and that they're not able to support their community in the same way. More importantly, as it relates to the environmental implications, farmers are not able to reinvest into new technologies, new practices and new equipment to actually improve environmental outcomes.

This issue, unfortunately, has become political. It was not really meant to be political: That's why we saw such cross-partisan support for Bill C-234. It became political when the Prime Minister decided that 3% of Canadians were going to receive a break on the carbon tax on home heating, stepping back on a major marquee policy.

This legislation is about doing the right thing for Canadian farmers, doing the right things for Canadian consumers and passing this legislation. The Senate is absolutely playing shenanigans with this legislation.

To the point of the carbon tax, I understand what it is trying to use. It's trying to use market dynamics. In the case of these practices, much like operating a tractor or a combine on a field, there are simply no alternatives available.

Last, I would just say that it is unheard of in the Senate to do this to a private member's bill. I would just urge all members of Parliament to consider that if it were your private member's bill that was making its way through the House of Commons effectively, passing through the democratically elected chamber, only to be delayed by the unelected Senate—

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac, QC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[Branden Leslie, Conservative, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

—I think you would be very opposed, so stop playing these games.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

I'm sorry, Mr. Leslie, but I have to interrupt you. I'll come back to you.

Madame Chatel, you have a point of order.

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac, QC]

I have two points to make.

First, I would like to know what the list of speakers is.

Second, I would like to ask my colleague to be a little briefer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

I do not know where we are on this.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Am I up next?

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

No.

I think I had stopped the clock. We had got to six minutes, so the Conservatives' turn is over.

I believe that answers the question you asked in your point of order, is that right, Ms. Chatel?

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac, QC]

No. I would like to know the order in which people who want to speak to this motion will be speaking.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Right. I had misunderstood.

It will be Mr. van Koeverden, Ms. Pauzé, Mr. Mazier, Mr. Ali, and Ms. Taylor Roy.

We will go back to Mr. Leslie.

[Branden Leslie, Conservative, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I had almost concluded.

I have no more to say other than that this is the right thing. The Senate needs to get out of the way. We should be adding our voices as parliamentarians, as duly elected members of the House of Commons who supported this legislation, and call on the Senate to do the right thing and pass this legislation unamended, immediately, so that we can give a billion-dollar break to hard-working Canadian farmers.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

MP van Koeverden, go ahead.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Whoa, Mr. Chair—

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

I am next.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

I challenge the chair on the speaking order.