Evidence of meeting #13 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was mulroney.
A recording is available from Parliament.
February 5th, 2008 / 4:05 p.m.
Conservative
Russ Hiebert Conservative South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, BC
I thought you mentioned that Mr. Mulroney killed the project.
As an Individual
He killed it, but it seemed to come back. It was like the phoenix.
I'll give you two anecdotes. One is from Harry Swain, a deputy minister who might be known to some of the official opposition members who sat in government. In his first briefing of his minister, John Manley, in 1993, Mr. Manley asked him, do you have any advice for a new minister? He said he had two pieces of advice: first, you should read Yes, Minister; secondly, don't ever meet with Karlheinz Schreiber. Those were his two pieces of advice.
The second anecdote is a statement made by Glen Shortliffe, who is a former Clerk of the Privy Council, talking about the Bear Head project: It was like this whac-a-mole that would never stay down; it kept coming back. To me, it was like the phoenix; it kept rising from the ashes. And I want to know whether there's more than smoke there. It just wouldn't die.
Conservative
Russ Hiebert Conservative South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, BC
All right. My time is limited.
You mentioned that you met with the RCMP. Can you tell us what you told them at the time about what you knew about the Bear Head project and the Airbus situation?
As an Individual
To save you time, it's all in the statement I gave them, which should be available to your committee. It was a sworn statement; it was signed. The statement was referred to in the letter that went to the Swiss government. So it's all there, and I wouldn't change a word that I said, particularly because it's 13 years later, and I'm sure my memory was better back then than it is—
Conservative
As an Individual
Well, I have new information that I learned subsequently; for example, that it didn't die. When I left the Prime Minister's Office I thought it was dead. I was very surprised when I came back from the Middle East to find out not only that it wasn't dead, but that Marc Lalonde had been involved in it in some way. I was astonished.
Conservative
Russ Hiebert Conservative South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, BC
As a last question, do you have any evidence of any wrongdoing related to the Bear Head project?
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Thank you.
Mr. Spector, with regard to the identity of the RCMP investigator you referred to, was it Inspector Al Matthews?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Was the RCMP inspector you referred to who had knowledge of the three payments Inspector Al Matthews?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Thank you.
With regard to the expense report that you went through very briefly, the $101,000 between October 1986 and June 1997, which annualized was somewhere around $135,000, can you just confirm to the committee that the reimbursed expenses, which are called personal expenses—and they include salary of a person for their own use, Palm Beach trips, Rome satellite services, theatre tickets, flowers, restaurants—are all personal expenses not to do with being Prime Minister?
As an Individual
I can only confirm what's on that document. I had no knowledge of this. It says “personal”, as you can see for yourself, so you know as much about this document as I do.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
You stated that it was determined by the Canada Revenue Agency that the moneys were not taxable.
As an Individual
That's on the first arrangement. I know nothing about this arrangement, including anything related to taxation.
Liberal
Liberal
Sukh Dhaliwal Liberal Newton—North Delta, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Welcome, Mr. Spector, to this committee.
As PC Party treasurer in the early 1990s, was Mr. Jim Prentice aware of those payments to Mr. Mulroney that you talked about?
As an Individual
I never knew Jim Prentice. I still don't know him. I've never met the man, either then or now.
My understanding, from reading correspondence and from what I knew of those ties, is that current Senator Angus was a key player in these arrangements. I had never heard the name Jim Prentice.
Liberal
Sukh Dhaliwal Liberal Newton—North Delta, BC
You mentioned that while Doucet was a lobbyist, he would bring people to Mr. Mulroney's Hill office, and that these appointments were not booked through your office. Could you please explain how these meetings took place?