Evidence of meeting #34 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was response.
A recording is available from Parliament.
10:50 a.m.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
I would formally request that you read back the transcript, please.
10:50 a.m.
Liberal
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Excuse me, Mr. Dechert, be patient.
The last speaker having questions for Mr. Marleau was Mr. Dechert.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
When I'm finished. I'll give you an idea of when I'm finished.
When you finished and I came to the clerk, Mr. Poilievre had his name on the list. He was not in the room and I couldn't call him. Subsequent to that, Mr. Rickford, after I then made this intervention about trying to suggest.... At that point, once there's nobody in the room--
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Excuse me.
My view was that we were at the point where there were no more rounds of questioning for Mr. Marleau, but because there was a motion, theoretically--and maybe in fact--once a member makes a motion, all things stop and you have to deal with the motion.
I say to Mr. Dechert and all honourable colleagues that I dealt with it this way because I think you've all been around long enough to know where this might go. I'm trying to find a way in which we can deal with this in a fashion that allows all interested parties, including the minister, to have a position on the table, before the committee makes any decision as to whether or not it wants to go to the House.
If the members want to push the “follow the rules” exactly, then the chair has been in order, and hearing anybody speak after Mr. Martin moved his motion was improper. That's where we are.
At this point, if members would like to carry on a conversation with Mr. Marleau and ask a question--he is here for another few minutes--I'd be happy to do that. He'll be out of the country for the next two weeks, so this is it. But if you'd like to have some input with regard to where we go from here, that's also welcome. We'll see where we are. Keep in mind that Mr. Marleau is only here for another five minutes.
There's a point of order from Mr. Wrzesnewskyj, and make sure it's a point of order.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Thank you, Chair.
A certain type of conduct and behaviour should not be acceptable. Of course, there's an attempt here to go back and filibuster our particular discussion.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
The point of order is that when Mr. Dechert motioned toward the chair in a way suggesting that the chair was Pinocchio in this manner, it is not the type of conduct that should be acceptable in a parliamentary committee and I think he should apologize to the chair for his conduct.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Thank you. That's not a point of order. I'm a big boy; I can take it.
Mr. Poilievre, I'd like to hear from you, please.
10:55 a.m.
Conservative
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
It's whatever you want to do, whatever you want to say. You know where the committee is right now. If there are no further speakers, then I have to ask Mr. Martin if he wants to move his motion.
10:55 a.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
So I can talk about anything I want at this moment in time?
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
As I indicated, if you would like to ask Mr. Marleau some questions or you would like to give the committee your views as to where we go from here....
I thought it was a good idea that we at least offer the minister an opportunity to respond to Mr. Marleau's assessment and reaction. That's new information. If that's not the view of the committee, then we have to consider a motion to report.
The chair does not tell the committee what we're doing; it responds to the committee's wish as to where we go from here. So I'm looking for some words of wisdom from the honourable members.
10:55 a.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
I will try to fill my words with all kinds of sagacity, then, Mr. Chair. I will do so by offering a motion of my own.
I think Mr. Martin will appreciate this motion. I know he has a long history of working on the issue of access to information; he's very passionate about it, very knowledgeable on the subject. I'm hoping we can, as committee members, work together on this to continue the dialogue with the government.
I think it would be helpful if we put the discussion in its proper context. That's why I propose the following motion, which is a factual statement coming from our witness. It is merely a reiteration of something he has already said.
My motion reads as follows:
The Federal Accountability Act is the greatest reform to the ATIA since that act came into force in 1983, and—
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Order, please.
I've made a mistake and I want to correct it quickly.
Mr. Martin in fact did make a motion and it's on the table. He can withdraw it; I can't ask him not.... I misspoke by saying I would see whether Mr. Martin wanted to move his motion; he had already moved it.
As you know, Mr. Poilievre, you can only have one motion on the floor at one time. So we could have amendments to Mr. Martin's motion, but we can't entertain a second motion once there's one on the floor.
I'm indicating to you that I will not be accepting your motion at this point.
10:55 a.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
That's fair enough.
At the same time, there has to be a way that we can have the minister respond to the new information that has come forward from Mr. Marleau. Perhaps an intermediary step would be to contact the minister through the chair to see whether he has a response. That might take us some distance.
I know what Mr. Martin is getting at. I have said in my remarks that he has a long history of working on this file—as have you, Mr. Chair—so I can appreciate the desire of members of the opposition to move with haste. At the same time, I think we should be deliberate, and if we could prepare a letter on behalf of the committee indicating what we've heard from Mr. Marleau, asking for a response with a deadline, then I think we probably would move the file forward faster than instigating more confrontation and more clashing. That's how I would propose we move forward.
11 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
I thank you for that.
Colleagues, it is now 11 o'clock. There is another committee scheduled to be in this room now. We are bumping our heads.
I have listened. We have not in fact reached a total consensus. I'm going to accept Mr. Poilievre's suggestion that it does not hurt to ask the minister whether he has any further response to the committee, taking into account what has happened here.
At our next meeting, Mr. Martin's motion is alive and well.
11 a.m.
An hon. member
Is it alive and on the floor?
11 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
It is. Unfortunately, I can't entertain any more speakers because the meeting has to be adjourned.
I will forthwith get a communication to the minister. He will have access to all the comments that have been made at this meeting; I'll make sure he has it. We will see what I can report back.
I should say again that on November 5, the privacy people cannot be here. So don't plan for that. I'm going to see whether PCO officials would be prepared to move up from the week after we get back to next week, if that's an option and we can't fill that slot. I will keep you informed so that you know exactly what we're dealing with before you come to a meeting.
Mr. Marleau, I have no time to say this, but quite simply, on behalf of all of the committee and all Canadians, I want to thank you for the service that you provided, not only to us but to all Canadians, with wisdom, with passion, and with class. Thank you.
11 a.m.
Some hon. members
Hear, hear!