Evidence of meeting #24 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
A video is available from Parliament.
3:40 p.m.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
As far as your ability to deliver the program in Quebec was concerned, I understand you hired the public relations firm NATIONAL to handle that.
In the past, had WE Charity delivered similar programs in French in Quebec?
3:40 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
For example, the previous member asked us this, and I repeat the same example. We ran one of the largest service programs in the province, engaging 400 schools—
3:40 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
Yes, it was fully bilingual.
The office [Technical difficulty—Editor]—
3:40 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
—WE Day events were held entirely in French. The purpose was to celebrate all the students who had volunteered in their communities for a year.
Our team did [Inaudible—Editor] tours in schools in Quebec and created resources for educators. Events for youth were conducted in French all over the province.
3:40 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Chris Warkentin
Pardon me, Mr. Fortin, we've given you some extended grace in terms of time frame.
We're going to move to Mr. Angus.
3:40 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
Thank you, Chair.
One of the things that's been difficult for everyone is trying to get a sense of how you operate. Because of the multitude of companies, the multitude of side holdings, and the vast real estate empire, it has certainly drawn a lot of attention through numbered companies and your personal holdings. We're not really sure.
I was really interested, because the other day I saw an article in the National Post. It said that one of the reasons you do this is “a deliberate strategy to operate efficiently and avoid office leasing and rental costs”, and that's the reason to have such a vast real estate empire.
When you signed the deal with the federal government, in the budget that you brought forward, you wrote in $590,000 in rent. Over the course of the 100 days for that period of the cohort in the budget, that would have been about $200,000 a month in rent. That's pretty extraordinary.
Why should we be paying rent to your organization, when you say you have control of the buildings?
3:40 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
To be clear, it wasn't necessarily for our organization. To remind the member, at that point, back a year ago, no one knew whether we needed special filtration systems and plexiglass to separate people. We were putting a potential line item. If I could also share, there were 13 different references to audit in that document, and those were the only ones used to deliver to [Inaudible—Editor].
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
The idea of $200,000 a month in rent is extraordinary. The reason I ask is, again, when you guys came here last July, you insisted on testifying under oath, and you made it very clear that no money was going to your organization. It was all going to programming. You made a big deal that there were no administration fees.
My Liberal colleagues were geared up to ask you that a couple of times, and you said there were no administration fees. I look into the budget, and I see $590,000 for rent for you guys. It's not for other charities, because the other charitable programming is separate. On top of that, it says 15% administration fee for WE Charity.
Why didn't you guys just say, yes, of course, there's an administration fee, which is reasonable? Instead, you swore under oath that you were not taking any administration fees, so we're paying you nearly $600,000 for three months for rent. We're paying for the phones plus the administration fee.
Why didn't you just tell us there was an administration fee?
March 15th, 2021 / 3:45 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
With respect, you're misrepresenting us. We said there was no profit that was going to be kept—
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
No, no, you actually said administration fee. I've got it in the records. You used the words “administration fee”, and it struck me as odd at the time. That's why, when we finally got a copy of the budget, I checked, and there is a 15% administration fee. That's separate from all the other things.
Wouldn't it be easier just to say these things, then we wouldn't be asking, and feel so mistrustful of you?
3:45 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
We don't hide the fact that to run a program it costs administration. Of course it does.
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
I know, but why did you tell the committee that you weren't taking any administration fees? Why didn't you tell us you were getting $200,000 a month rent on your buildings in Toronto?
That's a whack of public money paying your ME to WE operation.
3:45 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
Your statement is not correct.
What we said was that every program has administration, because it requires administration to deliver it. That administration was solely to deliver the program. It's a reasonable—
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
That's not what you said.
Our friend, Mr. Fraser, from Nova Scotia asked whether you were telling him there were no administration fees, and you said it was all going to programming.
However, when we look at the budget....I'm not trying to be a hard guy here, but if I got straight answers last July, we wouldn't be here now. It was a simple question.
Programming is separate. It's a line item. The rent is a line item. The telephones are a line item, and your 15% administration fees, about which you could have just said, yes, it's 15%, but you said, no, it was all going to programming.
I don't know why this misrepresentation always happens. You wouldn't be so under fire now if you had said, yes, 15% administration fees, but under oath you said there were none.
3:45 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
Mr. Angus, with respect, I don't feel you know how to read the budget properly. It's an administration fee for the program. We said all the money was going to the program, and as a result, we were not going to make a profit, because we were asked by the Government of Canada, in record time, to help—
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
Perhaps I can't read a budget, but I can read that we're spending $600,000 on rent on your downtown Toronto properties.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Chris Warkentin
Thank you, Mr. Angus.
We're going to turn to Mr. Gourde for his round of questions.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
Jacques Gourde Conservative Lévis—Lotbinière, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Kielburger, the Government of Canada contacted you to administer the Canada student service grant program for 40,000 students. Is that true or false?
3:45 p.m.
Founder, WE Charity
Was the question, did the federal government contact us to deliver the program? Yes, it contacted us.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
Jacques Gourde Conservative Lévis—Lotbinière, QC
The government contacted you to administer the program to help 40,000 students. Is that correct?