Information & Ethics Committee on April 21st, 2023

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

All right.

Has it happened often? What impact did it have?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

It's certainly happened a lot more often than we knew. However, what we do know is that it happened frequently and, in particular, that the main actor was Russia.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

So it's always been Russia. All right.

I'll leave the last two minutes for you to tell us, in your own words, what steps you would suggest we take.

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

I feel that regulating platforms is crucial if you want to fight disinformation. Accountability just needs to be imposed. We can't live in a world with no accountability. When the newspaper publishes information that is questionable, it's accountable for that information. Why shouldn't the platforms that let this information go viral be accountable? That's the first thing. We're talking about content here.

In addition, I believe the fundamental point we need to understand is how significant the press and NGOs are in the democratic ecosystem. We need to go beyond simple market logic and let these organizations receive constant support.

Lastly, I feel that fundamentally, we also need to understand that we're up against enemies of democracy and that they will see any weakness as an invitation to attack. So we need sanction regimes. The European Union has a toolbox, but it still hasn't used any of the tools.

In the case of Qatargate, the scandal we've mentioned, sanctions will be imposed on those who let themselves be corrupted, but what sanctions will be imposed on the Qatar regime that's linked to that corruption? It will face no sanctions.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Whoa! That's incredible. It's fascinating what happened in Qatar.

Is it possible for you to share with the committee what kind of toolbox you were talking about?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

Yes, of course. We'll also pass on the results of the ongoing negotiations and recommendations for change.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

That would be wonderful.

Thank you so much for your testimony.

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

Thank you as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you, Mr. Glucksmann and Mr. Villemure.

We will go to Mr. Green for the final questions.

Matt, you have five minutes. Go ahead, please.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Glucksmann, I think you can see that your popularity at this committee is warranted by our reflections on what we can do in an ongoing way. I note that, as the chair of the special committee, the European Union has endeavoured to keep up with the evolving nature of the threat.

I know you've been reluctant to make recommendations, but that is how our committee works. We've invited you here and we would ask for your candour.

What kinds of recommendations can your special committee make to the EU and the European Parliament?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

I'm perfectly happy to make recommendations to the EU and the European Parliament, but I was just shy about making recommendations to you because I don't know the Canadian situation well enough.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Fair enough.

What kinds of recommendations can you make through your special committee to the EU?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

First, we have to protect general interests from foreign interference, but now we are also dealing with private interest interference in our committee. For instance, the hottest discussion now in our committee is about conflict of interest of elected members. This is a key debate that we are having. What we have to keep in mind is that the struggle against corruption is not only a question of morals or ethics. It's also a question of the strengths or weaknesses of our institutions.

I am not a moralist. I'm not even a novelist. I'm an elected politician. I don't care about anybody's private soul. I care about the fate of nations, of systems. Corruption is a danger for the survival of democracy. It's a tool used by foreign powers to weaken and make our nations subservient. That's the thing we in the European Parliament are working on as we speak.

The second thing is to reassert the notion of public scrutiny, both in terms of the question of platforms and in terms of the question of how value chains of the biggest European companies are being used by the Chinese regime, as we speak, to weaken us on strategic issues. This is something that's key, and that's why we also work with our friends from—

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

I'm going to have to proceed through my line of questioning—my apologies.

I'll put it to you straight: Do you think a similar committee could be worthwhile here in Canada, yes or no? It's okay if you feel uncomfortable.

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

I feel uncomfortable.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

I am worried about the fate of the nation.

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

I encourage every single democratic institution to have this kind of committee.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Do you believe that every democratic state should have a foreign agent registry?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

I think it would be wise, but we don't have that in Europe yet.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Are you considering it?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

We are discussing it with the commission.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

How does your special committee plan to implement, within the European Union, a coordinated strategy against foreign interference as recommended by the resolution adopted on March 9, which calls for that?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

We have worked with the European Commission on the package that will be out at the end of this spring, which is called the “defence of democracy” package. I think that will be the approach.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Out of the many resolutions or recommendations, which do you consider to be the most urgent?

[Raphaël Glucksmann]

All of them are. The main one would be.... I'm sorry but you got me on this one.