Finance Committee on Oct. 2nd, 2006

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

That's not a point of order, ma'am.

We'll proceed with Mr. Pacetti's round. Continue, sir.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

I don't see how the Liberal Party would not be in favour of those programs that we in fact....

Let me just get to the point. I want to thank the groups for coming here today, because it was important for us. Ms. Ablonczy stated that we decided to come out here on purpose because we wanted to hear from you guys. But there seems to be a theme in common, from the first presenter to the last one: lack of funding. Even if we recommend certain programs be implemented, I think there's still going to be a lack of funding.

From the few people we spoke to yesterday, apparently your economy's booming. There are jobs—some people are holding two or three jobs—and there are people making money out here, but I think there's still a common theme, that there's a lack of funding.

We're limited in our time, so I'd like to go around the table again. I don't want to play partisan politics, but two of the biggest programs we had were the transfer tax on the excise tax. Is that making your situation easier, Mr. Eglinski?

If I can keep the answers limited, then I can go around the table a little bit quicker.

[Jim Eglinski]

It doesn't really make it any easier. Infrastructure is a big demand, and—I'm just going to refer to it as “industry”—industry has a hard time enticing people to come and work north. People who come to work north want to have the luxuries they have in Calgary or Toronto. They want to have the arts, the culture. That's the infrastructure that's really being demanded in communities such as ours. We need to see more funding coming that way, that would support our recreation.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

But how do we transfer? Even if we increase infrastructure money and recommend that increased moneys be transferred to infrastructure, this will not help your city in particular, because the money will be allocated on a per capita basis.

Will that help you?

[Jim Eglinski]

It may help another city. It may help another area, another community. It may not help us directly.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

The same thing, Ms. Throssell, with the child care.... We did have an agreement with the Yukon territory. Would the money have been transferred? I'm not sure how much money.

Larry, you stated there was a couple million dollars promised to the Yukon. It was $5 million.

Would that have done the trick? You stated that child care is in a crisis. Would that have helped? Is that going to help? I think the $5 million was committed, but I think it's going to end this year.

[Debbie Throssell]

That would be very helpful, but my concern is if that $5 million is distributed through all of the north, including Nunavut and the NWT, which would make less come to Yukon day care.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Taylor, how is your funding? How is Yukon tourism funded?

[Rod Taylor]

The truth of the matter is that compared to all the other industries represented here, it isn't funded federally per se, other than the CTC. That's obviously the key that we get. In order for us to be able to compete in a global market, the CTC needs to have its funding increased.

I'll give you one example. The 3% GST rebate is projected to bring in about $78 million in savings. That's $3 million more than the CTC is funded in total. So compared to Australia or Germany—

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

So you're funded through CTC?

[Rod Taylor]

We're not. The Yukon government funds the Yukon territorial marketing division of our tourism stuff. But having said that, the CTC's general marketing programs—marketing Canada in general and the north in particular—have a huge effect on my ability as an operator to bring people here. End of story.

So every time they get cut, it does hurt me. From a federal perspective, it's the CTC that has an impact on my business and businesses in the Yukon.

Territorially speaking, we actually do okay. We could always use more, but the fact is we've done all right.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Mackay, how would it affect the colleges in the Yukon if transfers were made on a per capita basis?

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

You have fifteen seconds, sir.

[Stu Mackay]

Obviously if it's per capita, we would not support it. We would look for different models. I would suggest we look to the models on the health side. In fact, we may even want to look at post-secondary education forming its own transfer payments, as health did. We would look for agreements such as the premiers offered last time on the health issue.

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

Thank you, sir.

Mr. St-Cyr.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I have a fairly general question about a unique feature of the Yukon territory.

Yesterday, I met with some very delightful people who informed me that the Government of the Yukon was not in a position to levy taxes or to impose many of the restrictions that were being put in place by the provinces. I wondered about this and about the impact this may have on your communities.

As a Bloc Québécois member, I'm somewhat concerned that communities should have the right to levy their own taxes and make their own choices. I realize that this isn't necessarily one of the demands you're making as a group, but as Yukon residents, are you concerned at all about this matter?

Do you feel that a territory like the Yukon should have the right, like any province, to levy its own taxes and make its own decisions?

We can go around the table and hear from anyone who might wish to speak to this fairly general question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

Mr. Eglinski, would you like to begin?

[Jim Eglinski]

It wouldn't be fair because I'm not in the Yukon. It would not really affect us at the present time, so I'll turn it over.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Have you every given this any thought, Ms. Baltgailis?

[Karen Baltgailis]

All I know is that every time I do my income tax I have a Yukon section to fill out, so I'm not quite sure how it all works. So I'm probably not the person to answer this question.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

As far as jurisdiction goes, what's the difference between a territory and a province?

Ms. Adamson?

[Shirley Adamson]

I would like to address the question, obviously not from the perspective of the Government of the Yukon or as an elected official, but as a taxpayer and as a member of a self-governing first nation. At the end of the year when we pay our taxes, we pay our taxes in a formula, a portion of which goes to the federal government and a portion of which goes to the Government of the Yukon.

Because I'm a member of a self-governing first nation, the first nation to which I belong also occupies tax room. So a formula between the federal and first nations governments ensures that the taxes I pay at the end of the year transfer back to the first nation.

That said, I guess the opinion I share as a taxpayer, as a first nation individual, is that it's not likely that the Government of Yukon ought to move quickly towards that sort of status, because there are a number of first nations yet without a land claim agreement. So the kind of certainty that the government takes to the table is not necessarily there yet. I offer that, but I think the grand chief may want to expand a bit on it.

[Grand Chief Andy Carvill]

I concur with those comments. I think there are a number of first nations that have yet to finalize their agreements in the Yukon. I know there has been some discussion in the past around the Yukon having a province-like status. At this point in time it's not something that's supported by the Council of Yukon First Nations until we get the other first nations to the table and look at agreements, and then we can look at it as a collective.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

I have a brief question for Ms. Throssel.

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

A very brief question, sir. You have ten seconds remaining.