Evidence of meeting #26 for Finance in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
11:40 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Brian Pallister
I'm sorry, the time is Mr. Del Mastro's. He actually chairs his piece, unless he causes decorum to falter.
Proceed as you wish.
11:40 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
I'll give you a chance in just a second, because there was something else I wanted to establish.
We're going to spend about a quarter of a billion dollars in this year's budget on museums in Canada. We're working towards the establishment of a long-term museum program.
One thing I got from both presentations was an understanding that your federal funding is constantly fluctuating. Under this long-term program, would it be more beneficial if you could count on a more straight-line funding so you would have some idea as to what the federal government's portion of your costs would be?
11:45 a.m.
Executive Director, Yukon Historical and Museums Association
That's something we've been advocating for, beginning as long-term stable funding. We need to know—it can't be year to year—whether or not we're going to have something.
We need something that meets today's needs. We don't want to be at 1972 levels; we need to be at 2006-07 levels that can actually meet the needs of museums across Canada—and not just supporting the large national museums: we need to have something that's going to benefit the small and medium-sized rural museums, where we really need that money.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
Okay, thank you.
Ms. Cunning, did you want to touch on that? Just with the long-term strategy, would it be more beneficial if you could count on more of a straight-line percentage of your costs?
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
Okay, thank you. I'll definitely put that recommendation forward.
Ms. Morgan, first of all, I agree with you that the clawback on GIS should be definitely...if not virtually eliminated, the barrier should be increased substantially.
I pulled out a line from your presentation where I just don't quite understand what you're getting at. You said we need to review the pension system in Canada so it helps those most in need instead of punishing them. Do you think our pension system is punitive?
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
11:45 a.m.
President, Yukon Council on Aging
Well, look at the OAS system. You can get full OAS until you reach $60,000. So you are taking out of the taxpayer's pocket $487—let's use $500 as the general figure. You're giving every senior over the age of 65 in Canada, many of them living abroad, $500 until they reach $60,000. The clawback takes place at $60,000, and they can still continue to get some taxpayers' money until they make $100,000. Yet what about the GIS? At $14,800 they start clawing those poor people back.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
I don't disagree with the point you're making. In fact, one of the things—because we only came in a little while ago, we inherited the system—is that I'd really like to see reforms made in the pension program. I just wanted to understand a little more your point, and I've got it.
11:45 a.m.
President, Yukon Council on Aging
When they go out and try to help themselves by getting a job, and their GIS is taken away from them because they're trying to be self-sufficient, and their housing is raised to an unreasonable amount because they have to pay 25% of gross income, I think that's punishment.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
In my perfect world, Ms. Morgan, seniors would work if they chose to, but they would not be required to. I think they've made tremendous contributions to our communities, and I'd hate to think that—
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
—elderly people have to get a job so that they can afford to feed themselves.
Mr. Graham—
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Brian Pallister
Mr. Del Mastro, your time is over.
Madam Wasylycia-Leis, it's over to you for six minutes.
11:45 a.m.
NDP
Judy Wasylycia-Leis NDP Winnipeg North, MB
Well, let me just start by saying I don't know where Mr. Del Mastro has been. We've heard from seniors over the years how they must struggle to actually choose between paying for necessary medications or putting food on the table.
I'm sure you could give some testimony to the struggle seniors face on a day-to-day basis.
11:45 a.m.
President, Yukon Council on Aging
Unfortunately, when I go out to seniors' organizations and meetings in the south I'm shocked at how poorly seniors in other parts of Canada are treated compared with those in the Yukon territory. We do not pay for our medication in the Yukon; we have a marvellous pharmacare program that looks after us healthwise.
But it's true. If you're making $1,300 a month or less and are living in subsidized housing and are told 25% of that goes to housing, what do you have left to feed yourself, clothe yourself, look after yourself? It's very sad.
11:45 a.m.
NDP
Judy Wasylycia-Leis NDP Winnipeg North, MB
Thank you very much. So many questions....
Let me go next to Sierra. You notice that the Conservatives, when they talked about putting money back or ensuring that museum cuts don't affect the operations of those museums, didn't talk about literacy. In the media, you've actually mentioned this. Now I know you're a real person. On September 28 you said your group will lose $315,000. That sounds like an awful lot of money for the Yukon Literacy Coalition.
Could you give some indication to this committee what that will do to your work, what the long-term effects are? And do you have any reason to believe that in fact the Conservatives may reconsider that direct hit to literacy coalitions?
11:50 a.m.
Communication Coordinator, Yukon Literacy Coalition
It's interesting that you say long-term effects. As of now, with that kind of hit, there may not be a long term for coalitions such as the Yukon Literacy Coalition.
We've been in contact with coalitions across the country, and the cuts we face are similar to those in NWT, Nunavut, and the provinces. We believe the effects will mean the eventual closure of most of the literacy coalitions across the country, which will have a profound effect on the ability to offer services.
The effect of this funding cut on the Yukon Literacy Coalition means that we won't be able to deliver practitioner training. We won't be able to work with our families on family literacy initiatives. We were set to do community literacy initiatives with some of the smaller communities, focusing on first nations literacy, family literacy, and literacy for people with disabilities. Those programs won't be able to take place unless there is a reversal of the funding cuts or we are able to locate funding sources elsewhere.
11:50 a.m.
NDP
Judy Wasylycia-Leis NDP Winnipeg North, MB
It's rather ironic, isn't it, for a government that says it's committed to improving productivity and making our nation more competitive, to sort of cut the very heart and soul out of any kind of economic investment program?
11:50 a.m.
Communication Coordinator, Yukon Literacy Coalition
This is the one thing that coalitions have been saying in light of the recent literacy cuts. We feel it's very unfortunate, given that one of the major limitations right now for the economy is labour shortage, especially here in the Yukon. We've often heard that we don't have the labour capacity to meet our economic needs.
We do know that improving people's literacy and their basic skills will allow them to be more productive in the labour force and contribute in a greater degree to the economy of Canada and the Yukon.
11:50 a.m.
NDP
Judy Wasylycia-Leis NDP Winnipeg North, MB
Thank you.
On museums, for both Patricia and Rebecca, you've just heard the Conservatives say they're going to cut $4.6 million out of MAP, the museum assistance program, from a total budget of $8.4 million, I think, and it's not going to affect you at all.
Do you feel comforted that you'll get your $70,000 operating grant, or whatever you call it, from the government, despite this $4.6 million cutback?
11:50 a.m.
Executive Director, MacBride Museum
This program is application driven. Mr. Del Mastro may be privy to the fact that there are lapses in the program; museums certainly are not.
In five minutes there are only so many points we can speak to. One of them is that I am a full-time museum director, and the things I talk about that we do, we do with three staff.
Many of the institutions in the territory—which is the reason Rebecca is here—are small, seasonal museums. They haven't got the capacity to even apply to MAP. The process for applying to MAP is quite stringent, which it ought to be. There is a requirement for transparency and accountability, but museums don't know that it's underfunded.
This year, in spite of Minister Oda's ongoing commitment when she was in opposition to the idea that there would be a new museum strategy and better programs, the response to applications was ten weeks later than in normal years. So after having applied to MAP the previous November, you find out in July that you get funding and have to spend it by March 31. I think there's lots of room for ongoing improvement and for funding in that program.
11:50 a.m.
NDP
Judy Wasylycia-Leis NDP Winnipeg North, MB
Could I ask Rebecca on the same point? I think you've identified the fact that through these cuts there might be a double and triple whammy effect—not only the $4.6 million in MAP, but the $55,000 in the student employment or the career placement program, and then of course there is the community heritage property incentive pilot project. Can you give us a sense of what this is going to do to the quality of life in the Yukon, and the loss to our economy, the loss of jobs, and the whole economic vibrancy?