Finance Committee on Oct. 17th, 2006

[Michael Savage, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

What is the average cost of the vehicle?

[Al Cormier]

They start at $50,000 and go up. Buses go up to $700,000 or $800,000. The more expensive the vehicle, the higher the premium for the hybrid electric.

[Michael Savage, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

I found your brief very interesting and I think it's good work.

How many vehicles have to be in the marketplace before the incremental cost of the vehicle will be outweighed by the savings?

[Al Cormier]

We've consulted our industry members, and their collective estimate is about 10,000. Then you'll reach the tipping point where they're into mass production and lower premium prices.

[Michael Savage, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Eaton, like many people in Canada, I got involved in literacy at the local level. In Nova Scotia, we have Literacy Nova Scotia. Anne Marie Downey is a really passionate advocate. In my own hometown of Dartmouth we have Roderick Fraser. These people work on literacy with nothing, and it's an unbelievable slight to them that they would have a cut forced on them.

One can only shudder to think what Peter Gzowski might be thinking in his grave, as well as other champions of literacy. One of the great things about the Peter Gzowski golf tournaments, which support literacy, was that the golfers always heard from an adult learner after the golf tournament. I can think of so many times when people were amazed by the change in somebody who had access to literacy delivered through programs that are now facing cuts.

You've outlined your concerns here. This is more of a general question. Do you think it would be helpful for the federal cabinet to have a learner come and visit them at the next cabinet meeting, so they understand the difference literacy can make in somebody's life?

[Margaret Eaton]

I think that's a great idea. There's nothing like hearing someone who's gone through an adult learning program speak about their personal story to really move people and have them understand the issue. How do I make that offer to the federal cabinet?

[Michael Savage, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

We'll ask the chair to bring that to the House, I think.

[Margaret Eaton]

All right.

[Michael Savage, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Perhaps we'll look for unanimous consent.

That's all I have. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Brian Pallister]

We'll conclude with Mr. Del Mastro now.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Cormier, the proposal you're making is interesting. Would the types of vehicles you're proposing need to be recharged, as in plugged in, at the end of the day?

[Al Cormier]

Yes, the battery's got to be charged at night, but they also recharge during their operation, through regenerative braking.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Okay, but it's not a 100% efficient system. They do need to be plugged in.

[Al Cormier]

It's not a totally battery-electric vehicle; it's hybrid electric.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

The other thing we need to ponder while we're doing this--and certainly Ontario's a very good example--is that one of our chief polluters is the generation of hydro; we may in fact be moving pollution from the tailpipe to the stacks of our coal-fired generating stations. We may not have a net gain.

[Al Cormier]

In the hybrid technology the motor will charge the batteries; it doesn't necessarily need to plug in. In the pure electric it has to be plugged in, and that's done in the off-peak hours.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

It seems we need to do a little bit of hand in hand. The point I was making is that we need to bring around our generation technology to really take advantage of that type of proposal.

Ms. Eaton, I'm going to come back to you for a moment. I know you've been very popular today, and I apologize if it seems as if you're being asked an excessive number of questions.

You indicated nine million Canadians suffer from low literacy. Can you define low literacy? Are these people who can't read their bills or read the newspaper?

[Margaret Eaton]

Yes. It's a standard set out by an international organization that ranks literacy levels around the world. They've determined that level three is what is required for people to get along in the western world. It's on a scale of one to five. The people at levels one and two in Canada, who are the 42%, are adults who have anywhere from very little literacy--they cannot read and write--up to, say, grade 10 or 11.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

How do they determine the number? I don't think I've ever been tested, or if I was, I wasn't literate enough to pick up on the fact that they were testing me.

I'm just wondering how they determine that nine million Canadians don't have the skills.

[Margaret Eaton]

Oh, I see. Statistics Canada, in partnership with the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development, did this study in 2003. They tested 5,000 Canadians and 5,000 people in western nations. I think another six or seven nations participated in the survey.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Okay. Would you consider the source to be unbiased?

[Margaret Eaton]

Yes, absolutely.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Okay. Was the test sample sufficiently large to determine that nine million Canadians are of low...?

[Margaret Eaton]

Yes.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Here's the other question I wanted to ask you: can you define literacy? One of the things I found a couple of weeks ago is that basically as we're sitting here and new technologies are becoming developed, not understanding how to operate that technology means we're becoming less literate.

Is that a definition of literacy you would operate by, or are you speaking strictly of reading and writing?