Finance Committee on Dec. 7th, 2007

[Pierre Thibaudeau]

You can be sure that we will not leave it at that. I would not hesitate for a moment to tell everyone that you are right, but this morning, you are wrong.

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

All right, fine.

[Pierre Thibaudeau]

We have been working on this issue for two years with nothing to show for it. So let's get back to each other.

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

No problem, it will be my pleasure.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

I think he's badgering the witness.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Pierre Thibaudeau]

Remember, you're in Quebec.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Did you want to take all your time, Mr. Harvey?

[Luc Harvey, Conservative, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Je vais donner le....

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Mr. Dykstra, go ahead.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Mr. Curran, you actually commented on the CANARIE program, and I was wondering if you could expand a little bit on it. I know we've provided funding; the multi-year funding on that is five years. Could you expand a little bit on how it specifically impacts the Canadian Association of Research Libraries? It intrigued me that you're among the few folks who have come forward to talk about an existing program and how it's been beneficial in a pretty strategic way.

[William Curran]

From the five years between 1999 and 2004, I have only one statistic I can share with you: CANARIE funded 32 projects through its $29 million cost-sharing e-learning program to promote innovative e-learning applications. That's probably the only fact I have on hand to answer your question.

As I said in my presentation, CARL strongly supports the government's move to make sure CANARIE is funded. It's funded for the next five years, and we're glad to see that.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Thanks.

I did want to ask Mr. Ryan a question.

I had a chance to go through your brief, and one of the things that intrigue me in terms of the success of the work and the building you've been doing over the last number of years is that you've been able to generate revenue. Not too many research organizations can lay claim to that.

This is a suggestion, and you can comment on whether you can do it: it would be extremely helpful if you could show your revenue projections over the next number of years in terms of how that would assist in covering the costs that you indicate of $100 million a year for the next eight years. The ability to understand how you would facilitate the revenue to be able to pay for the construction of the new facility would certainly provide a lot of assistance to us, not just on the government side but also the entire committee. Obviously we could then determine what our role as a government would be in that investment.

[Prof. Dominic Ryan]

I guess the most obvious is that when NRU was built, which is 50 years ago now, the expectation of revenue wasn't there. It was an investment in the future, and the possibilities were then built on as they came along. All of the new stuff that happened in the 50 years that it's been in existence and in operation is stuff that appeared and we were able to do because of the innovative design and the vision of the people who put it together.

So we can project, but as I try to say in my brief, it's very difficult to predict the future when you actually don't even know where you're starting. None of the things that have been done in NRU were planned when NRU was built. They all were enabled by its existence, so projecting what we're going to do when we do something new is really very difficult.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

I understand it, but I think it's going to have to be part and parcel of your presentation. I understand what you're saying, but I'm just making a suggestion.

Ms. Sly, I wanted to ask you a question.

Your brief indicates that you're a non-partisan organization, yet almost every request and suggestion and recommendation you make is against what the current government is doing. So I wanted to be clear and get it on the record that despite the fact that you've basically opposed everything this government has done in the last two years, you are non-partisan.

[Catharine Laidlaw-Sly]

You're quite right, we are not partisan. As a matter of fact, one of the issues your government has addressed is our request made some years ago to consider the age of consent. You have acted on that, and we congratulate you on the action taken.

We are quite happy to either criticize or advise any government at any level. I think the previous government and other parties can assure you that we've been equally critical.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

Thank you. I'm not worried about that, I'm just concerned about the way you presented it. It didn't accentuate the fact that you're non-partisan.

That's fine.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Thank you.

As the chair, I normally don't do this, but I'd like to ask a couple of questions, more just to get information from the presentations that I sense may help the committee a little bit.

I want to start with you, Ms. Laidlaw-Sly. In your presentation you commented on the Canada Health Act and said you supported the principles of the Canada Health Act.

[Catharine Laidlaw-Sly]

Yes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

I think that's fair enough; I think most Canadians do as well.

There is also a principle of the care guarantee and initiative that is taking place right now between the provinces and the federal government. I don't see that anywhere in your brief. Is that something you promote and agree with, or not?

[Catharine Laidlaw-Sly]

Yes, essentially, but we have not specifically addressed it in depth at the grass roots level. It's under discussion, but the last presentation we made on it was our brief to the Romanow commission dealing with the whole health care program in Canada. And yes, we were looking for more reasonable access to care--and timely access.

All of this has since been incorporated in aspirational goals, at the very least, for the system. But we repeat, some of those goals seem to be purely aspirational, which has a bit of a hot-air sound, doesn't it?

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Well, I think every province has initiated at least one care guarantee on one procedure, and this is a beginning, hopefully, of things to come. I just wanted to know whether in principle your foundation supported it or not.

[Catharine Laidlaw-Sly]

In principle, yes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

The other thing is, on the principle of the Canada Health Act, you also talked about your being opposed to private delivery of care.

[Catharine Laidlaw-Sly]

Yes, we are--private, for-profit, yes.