In terms of what the actual effect is of the interchange rate or the merchant discount rate, we have here a note of Visa's interchange fee schedule, and they have rates on their website from 1.21% to 2%.
On page 14, Madam Brisebois, you have figures here of examples of fees charged to the merchant. You have electronic and standard. For electronic, for premium credit cards, which would be in person, where I swipe my card, that would be 2.12%, whereas for standard, which I understand would be for phoning or online, it would 2.25%. Can you indicate to us where these figures are from?