Evidence of meeting #80 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was federal.
A video is available from Parliament.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
You are out of time, but perhaps we can follow up after the committee hearing.
Colleagues, I have four more members who would like to ask questions.
I will go now to Mr. Jean.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Thank you. I'll take up where Mr. Mai left off, actually, with Mr. Sanger.
Is public transportation important?
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Is it a great investment for the federal government to get involved with?
6:20 p.m.
Senior Economist, Canadian Union of Public Employees
We agree with the Federation of Canadian Municipalities, and yes, it's an important investment.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Did you have a chance to listen to the presentation by the public transit group that just came before us from Montreal, the Société de transport de Montréal?
6:20 p.m.
Senior Economist, Canadian Union of Public Employees
I'm sorry, I didn't follow it. I wasn't here for their presentation.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
On page 3 of the document they presented to us just a few minutes before you came, it says, and I quote:
Barely ten years ago, the federal government was not even contributing to public transportation. Today, its contribution reaches almost $1 billion a year through various infrastructure programs.
They indicate that between 2001 and 2005, the total amount invested in public infrastructure was around the $900 million mark, and now, with the federal government's initiatives through the economic action plan, which is obviously from 2006 to 2010, that amount is almost $4 billion a year now in 2010.
Were you aware of that?
6:20 p.m.
Senior Economist, Canadian Union of Public Employees
The federal government has certainly increased its funding for infrastructure, and that's a positive move. The problem is that it's run out, and we need a long-term commitment.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
That's my question, because what you said was bleak and bleary about this government. I'm glad so see that you're applauding us for the $1 billion a year in public infrastructure. I understand that's coming to an end. We're talking, of course, to our partners to rejuvenate that for another period of time. Obviously we will do what's in the best interests of the Canadian people.
My question is more driven towards the Alberta chamber, and as a past member of the Fort McMurray Chamber of Commerce for many years, and a director as well, I have to tell you that I was impressed that you came here today and said that we have a problem with labour.
With that, I'm going to take a different approach. I don't know if you heard CAPP earlier. It's good that you did. They indicated that although they recognize labour and labour mobility and bringing temporary foreign workers in, they recognize that without a distribution network for our natural gas and without a distribution network for our oil, we are in big trouble.
I'm going to give you some figures very quickly. They also indicated that to grow our economy is the only way to get a cheaper price, because it's a world-traded commodity. Is that fair to say? Do you agree to that?
6:20 p.m.
Chair Elect, Alberta Chambers of Commerce
Absolutely. Market diversity for this nation, not necessarily just for the province of Alberta, is critical.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Absolutely, and it's critical for the nation as a whole, because we all share in the great efforts of Alberta, Newfoundland, and wherever else we have a positive economy. Is that correct?
6:20 p.m.
Chair Elect, Alberta Chambers of Commerce
Absolutely. The contributions made to the development of infrastructure, and extractive infrastructure in particular, whether in Alberta or anywhere across the nation, by the provinces of Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, Saskatchewan are significant. All of those provinces certainly contribute significantly to milling the products necessary to build these things.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
With the extraction, my question is this. We have 2.8 million barrels a day being produced, and 1.7 million barrels a day produced in the oil sands, which is going to go up to 3.7 million barrels in the oil sands by 2020 and 4.3 million barrels by 2025 right across Canada. We're going to at least double the production and distribution of oil. How are we going to send it anywhere? We can't even send it now without discounting our oil to the Americans by up to 40%. That's $40 a barrel. How are we going to distribute it without some mechanism of distribution?
6:20 p.m.
Chair Elect, Alberta Chambers of Commerce
This really certainly brings into question the need for projects such as the Northern Gateway. We absolutely need some means of breaking into market diversity and creating that market diversity. In the absence of that, we are continuing to be price takers—
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
By that, do you mean we take the price that the Americans give us for our oil?
6:20 p.m.
Chair Elect, Alberta Chambers of Commerce
Absolutely, and all indications are that their move is towards greater energy independence by 2020. The potential for us to be in a further negative discount position by that point in time is certainly on the horizon.
6:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
You would also agree that this is one of the biggest threats to employment and to Canada's GDP in the future. That's the first question.
I don't know if you've extrapolated the figures, but based on the oil production that we have today and the oil production that we're planning on having by 2025, that's 267,000 additional full-time jobs for Canadians. Does that trouble you at all?
6:25 p.m.
Chair Elect, Alberta Chambers of Commerce
It certainly does. Without the ability to open our markets to create new customers for our resource products, certainly the ability for us to grow our GDP, to grow employment, and to grow household incomes is constrained and threatened.
6:25 p.m.
Conservative
6:25 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and hello to all the witnesses. Welcome to the finance committee.
Mr. Scholten, I see you have recommendations here on credit card fees, which we certainly agree need to be reduced, but I want to ask you about contraband and how big a problem it is for convenience store owners, for your membership.
6:25 p.m.
President, Canadian Convenience Stores Association
It's a tremendous problem for our retail members, for a couple of reasons.
First of all, we as responsible retailers comply with the laws and regulations regarding the sale of tobacco. We work very hard on that and make sure that we are a partner with the health authorities across the country to be able to enforce those laws.
Unfortunately, in the area of contraband, there's one law, but it seems to be applied differently in terms of those selling contraband. The Canadian government and the provincial governments are certainly working on that, but it does offer a great frustration for our retail members.
The second part of it is that tobacco as a category within our stores, a legal product for sale, contributes to the bottom line for retailers. Also, when someone comes into our stores and buys that product, they typically buy other products as well, so when they're not coming into our stores and they're not buying those products, retailers have a great challenge in surviving.
6:25 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
I assume this is essentially an issue at our borders with contraband coming into the country. Is it a problem that the government has cut hundreds of positions at border crossings so that there are fewer inspectors to be able to determine if there's contraband or—goodness knows—drugs or guns or other things at the border? Would that be a problem for your members?
6:25 p.m.
President, Canadian Convenience Stores Association
We do have great concerns about that, yes.