Finance Committee on Feb. 13th, 2014

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

In the States, if I buy something with my RBC credit card, is there a chance it will be found in the U.S. Patriot Act subject databases? Or do you know?

[Carolyn Burke]

I would need to have Amanda and George get back to you on that.

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Okay.

I'd appreciate knowing that, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Thank you, Mr. Rankin.

You can get back to me as the chair, and I'll ensure that all members get it.

We'll go now to Mr. Adler, please.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

Thank you very much, Chair.

Thank you to all of you for being here this afternoon. This is an absolutely fascinating topic.

To begin, Mr. Rankin mentioned the word “utility”. Ms. Hall Findlay spoke about utility also. But I want to speak about utility in terms of social utility, in terms of how mobile payment systems would benefit not just the traditional consumer, as we know them, but people who have disabilities, seniors, and people who are in rural areas.

How would mobile payments—the mobile payment “ecosystem”, as you've referred to it, in terms of the entire environment—help people who are traditionally disadvantaged? This is a huge benefit or boon.

[Martha Hall Findlay]

I don't know that mobile payments can solve a lot of the other challenges that some of those people might have in terms of their disabilities or—

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

You know, if you have....

[Martha Hall Findlay]

If you're able to use a phone, then you can pay for things more quickly, right? So that's wonderful. That's true regardless of your background or your location. If you can use a smartphone, or if you have a smartphone, you can make payments more quickly at a retailer who has the appropriate terminal.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

Right. But I'm just making reference to the fact that someone doesn't have to go out now and actually buy a gift card, for example. You can get it online, and you can send it to somebody halfway across the world, if you so choose.

[Martha Hall Findlay]

That is actually a great example, because you don't have to go and physically buy the card.

Another really nice thing about cards, which I find is a bit of a generational thing too, is that if you don't remember necessarily how much you have left on your card, you tend to not use it. I know this wasn't your question, but I'll point out that this is actually another benefit to merchants. It's the ability to use a card, to go in and buy something, when it's on your phone you can tap it, and it will tell you how much you have left on it.

But again, Mr. Adler, that's a benefit to everybody.

[William Giles]

I think you will also find there's a benefit in the interface that a phone provides that is superior to things we have had historically, which will give people an opportunity to...and as we have developers build in new applications for these phones, you will have some great advantages there.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

Yes, and that was exactly my point. That's what I was getting at. Maybe I just wasn't clear.

[Carolyn Burke]

Mr. Adler, perhaps I could give two concrete examples of where I think you're spot on in that analogy.

Royal Bank has had what we call northern outposts, where we've had difficulty bringing cash in. They are quite remote. We had tried to work around it in different ways. This would actually be an ideal way for people to exchange value.

As well, we have vulnerable senior citizens who are often in retirement homes, and we have had to send bankers in there so that they could pay for their hairdresser or their pharmaceuticals. This would allow the senior to retain their cash, and there would also be a trace on what they spent so that people who are vulnerable would be able to have their affairs audited.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

So this is a boon, then, to not just the traditional consumer, as we know them, but to society as a whole, really.

[Carolyn Burke]

That's right.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

I also want to talk a bit—

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

You have about a minute and a half, Mr. Adler.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

Thank you.

I also want to talk a bit about the sector in terms of employment and the growth of technology. In terms of where Canada stands in the world on this technology, we're near the top, aren't we?

[Derek Colfer]

We're at the top.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

At the top, so this is a huge Canadian success story that you're representing here today.

[Martha Hall Findlay]

Yes.

[Derek Colfer]

It is.

[Mark Adler, Conservative, York Centre, ON]

Are we exporting this technology abroad at the moment or not?

[Derek Colfer]

We are exporting a number of the painful lessons learned in deployments.

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