Finance Committee on March 6th, 2014

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay. So it will be another...

[René Morissette]

Yes, but certainly at least for recent years one could have a look at the data and see how these outcomes vary for immigrants, aboriginals, and other groups.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

So it's possible the data is there, but it's just not trending data?

[René Morissette]

It's possible, yes, from 2006 to 2013.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

My final question is on slide 11 where you talk about the average hourly wages for men and women in full-time jobs of the oil-producing provinces. I want to try to understand this correctly. We've seen more and more women enter the trades, which is fantastic to see.

Would some of this variation and let's use the oil-producing provinces as an example, would some of that be...? If it's trades related, do you know if some of that is because of the more recent entrance of women into the trades? There might be earlier levels of the block releases, for example, and they have not progressed as far, and that would be the difference in this wage rate.

[René Morissette]

I'm not sure I understand the question.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

The numbers between men and women are $29.87 versus $21.56. Women entered the trades only recently. Is the reason we see such a big difference in these oil-producing provinces because of the relatively, maybe even early, block release?

[René Morissette]

I think part of the reason is that the types of trades for young men and young women are still quite different. They are far from being homogenous. You will have more—plumbers, electricians, and so on—that are still male dominated and have high wages. Again, going back to the question on gender differences, we would really have to standardize for the different types.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

For the different trades.

Okay. Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Peggy Nash]

Thank you.

Mr. Van Kesteren, there are about two minutes left.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

Very quickly, going back to the numbers and it's all in the numbers, on chart 3, it's interesting to see that youth unemployment is going down somewhat and we had the periods of recession.

I should be looking at the Stats Canada people.

Also, I think there's a correlation here and maybe somebody can validate that. I'm looking at the next slide, which shows that the average number of weeks of employment for those who are 35 to 54 is greater than for youth.

Maybe I have to speak to somebody from the Department of Employment and Social Development. My take on that would be that as a younger worker you're finding yourself and you might try a job, but if it's not what you wanted, you switch to something else, whereas you become entrenched as you're older.

Am I right on that? Is it for that reason? Although there is higher unemployment, there is an advantage that we can move more quickly back into the workforce than once we become entrenched and just stick to the field that we've settled on. Is that accurate?

[Philippe Massé, Senior Director, Economic Policy Directorate, Department of Employment and Social Development]

I think that's part of the answer, but also youth are more in and out of the labour market naturally. They work while they study. As they enter the labour market they try different things. They're more willing to be in and out of the labour market in general.

As you mentioned, older workers do have perhaps less mobility once their skills get set. That is part of the explanation. René may have additional observations on that.

[René Morissette]

A pattern that we see sometimes is that older workers are in what we call “wait unemployment”. That is, they expect to find a job that pays as high a wage as in the previous job, but after a while they realize they can't and so there might be some time spent hoping to get as well paid a job as in the past. That may be one reason behind their longer duration of unemployment.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Peggy Nash]

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr. Van Kesteren and Mr. Allen.

Mr. Dubourg, you have five minutes.

[Emmanuel Dubourg, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

The subject is extremely important because we're talking about how to improve the employment landscape for young people. We know that we can and should do better.

My question is for Ms. Huziak, but

let me address it to Ms. Josephs, from the Canadian Youth Business Foundation.

A bit earlier, I was saying that although the Department of Employment and Social Development delivers a great many programs, young people do not necessarily know about them. And once they do learn about them, they say that all the red tape discourages them from participating. Is there anything you could suggest to improve that?

[Marsha Josephs]

One thing that we have heard across Canada in our round table consultations is that there might be a lot of programs out there that are very good programs, but many young people do not know about them. They have no idea that they exist. In one round table that we had here in Ottawa, there was a discussion around a program called BizPaL. No entrepreneur in the room knew that it existed. There was also another one, a business innovation program. No entrepreneur knew that it existed. Clearly, there is a challenge there that needs to be addressed. While there are lots of wonderful programs, they need to be out there in a very coordinated way and easily accessible so people are aware that they exist.

One thing that a few round tables had suggested is perhaps the government can take a look at more promotion to help build awareness around the types of programs that are out there.

[Emmanuel Dubourg, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

Thank you.

My next question is for the Statistics Canada officials, Ms. Morissette and Ms. Hale.

Earlier, I talked about how the unemployment rate among young immigrants, visible minorities, cultural communities and people with disabilities was much higher than for other groups. Many are shut out of the job market.

There is one thing I am curious about. Following the recession in 2008-09, did that gap skyrocket? What is the difference in the unemployment rates for those two groups? Did it go up?

[René Morissette]

I don't have any figures on that gap specifically. We do know that, during the recession, immigrants were more likely to lose their jobs and be laid off than non-immigrants. But one of the big reasons they were more likely to be laid off was that they had little seniority, as is the case for young people. Many companies adopt the last on, first off approach. So that's one factor. Although it isn't the only one, it does help to explain why they were hit harder than other workers.

[Emmanuel Dubourg, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

It wasn't a matter of their skills. It had more to do with their low level of seniority.

[René Morissette]

I can tell you that low seniority was one of the factors at play. The question around skills was not studied.

[Emmanuel Dubourg, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Peggy Nash]

You have a minute left if you'd like to carry on.

[Emmanuel Dubourg, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

In that case, Madam Chair, I will again turn to the officials from the Department of Employment and Social Development.

How can we make people aware of all the programs that exist? I know you have offices all over the country. Do department staff travel around? Do they meet with employers and other groups to encourage them to participate or apply for program funding?

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Peggy Nash]

Be very brief, please.

[David McGovern]

I sound like a broken record when I recite the number of websites that we use. We try to use channels of communication that actually target the audience. We know that youth in particular are looking for other channels of engagement with the government than previous generations. We have websites, we have products, we have Facebook pages, we have portals. The intent is to try to give information through as many different sources and in as many different formats as possible.