Finance Committee on Nov. 7th, 2013

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

I want to build on a question by my colleague Mr. Saxton. This is a question for Catherine Cobden of the Forest Products Association of Canada.

You talked about the importance of the industry in rural Canada and the remarkable and impressive improvements you've made in productivity. But I am very concerned about raw log exports. I get many letters on that topic.

I don't live in an area impacted by the mountain beetle; I live on Vancouver Island. I would like to know whether your organization has taken an official position on the export of raw logs.

[Catherine Cobden]

Our position is that from every tree harvested we need to get maximum value. You can interpret that to mean that the shipping of raw logs is not getting much value from the wood.

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Do you have any ability to discipline your members who choose to ignore that?

[Catherine Cobden]

I'm not sure which of our members are engaged in that practice, actually. I'd have to look into that particularly.

I think we would find that this isn't a common practice amongst the FPAC member companies. In fact, the FPAC member companies are fully committed to trying to get more value from every tree harvested. They are crafting this go-forward agenda.

I understand the frustration, but there are some unique circumstances that we have experienced in B.C.

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

You mentioned the pine beetle, but I don't see it on Vancouver Island.

[Catherine Cobden]

Yes.

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Mr. Patry, I have a question for you. You're with the Canada Foundation for Innovation.

Yesterday I made a statement in the House of Commons on behalf of the Canadian Consortium of Ocean Research Universities, referring to a report that appeared yesterday from the Council of Canadian Academies, which you referenced earlier, that said that there is a lack of coordination that limits the usefulness of the excellent ocean research that's being done in places like the University of Victoria and elsewhere. It said that there was no overarching national strategy or vision, little coordination, and inadequate leadership.

Does the Canada Foundation for Innovation accept that analysis, and if so, can it make recommendations on how we can address such a serious issue?

[Gilles Patry]

I would even go further. I think we can be an instrument for harmonizing the partnerships between the various institutions.

I was also at that meeting last night. We had nine universities that are essentially world-class universities in ocean and arctic research. One of our jobs at the Canada Foundation for Innovation is to ensure that we can maximize the use of the investments that we're making by fostering partnerships between institutions.

What you saw yesterday was a great example of that partnership and cooperation between institutions.

At the CFI we've invested $35 million in the Amundsen to make that vessel a research vessel. That vessel is being used by dozens of universities across Canada and around the world. We just finished a major partnership between the European Union, the U.S, and Canada on how we can best share arctic and ocean research facilities, so that we avoid duplication and minimize—

[Murray Rankin, NDP, Victoria, BC]

I really appreciate your saying that because the report went on to talk about Canada's aging research fleet.

At the University of Victoria, people are arriving from around the world to access the research we're doing on oceans. It's quite thrilling to see, but this report is damning and implying a lack of leadership that's very upsetting.

I want to go to Ms. Robinson of Polytechnics Canada and build on a question that Ms. Nash asked. You didn't have a chance to finish, so I hope I can ask you to expand a little bit. I'm very troubled by the apprenticeship deficit in Canada. You started to talk about the K-to-12 issue, then you began talking about some 400,000 people in the apprenticeship system. Can you continue on that? I wasn't entirely clear about the second point you were making.

[Nobina Robinson]

I think most Canadians, strangely enough, don't understand how apprenticeship works. It's a contract between an individual, a sponsoring company, governments that give support, and a master craftsperson or journeyperson who must teach the apprentice. That's what it is.

It is currently not part of post-secondary education. It is funded through EI. It is outside our normal community college vocational training for advanced technological credentials, and it's outside the universities.

One point of principle with which I would like to leave the committee is that it's time to treat an apprentice as a learner, not as an employee, and to stop supporting apprentices through the EI system.

Every time you sign up with a company you become indentured. You register as an apprentice at level one, and it goes up to level four. There are 400,000 registered apprentices in the country, yet we are saying we don't have skilled tradespeople. Something is going wrong. What we know, and what most studies—mostly by Canadian Apprenticeship Forum and other research bodies—will tell you is that there is a completion rate problem.

I'm happy to tell you more. We have lots more for you.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Thank you.

Thank you very much, Mr. Rankin.

We'll go to Mr. Hoback.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Thank you, Chair.

Are we going to have time for one more round for Mr. Jean, or should I be—

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Yes. I'll finish with Mr. Jean.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Okay. So there will be enough time to get us both in. Otherwise I would have shared some of my time with him. If you figure we'll get to him, then that's fine.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

We'll get to Mr. Jean. He'll wrap up the whole meeting for us.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Excellent.

You guys in the aerospace sector must be very excited about the new fighter jet program. Can you elaborate on what that means to you, in your sector?

[Iain Christie]

Replacing the CF-18s will be one of the largest expenditures that Canada has ever made in the aerospace sector. The entire sector is watching the current process that's under way with a great deal of interest to see exactly what the decision will be on how to proceed with that procurement.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Do you have any idea what the impact could be?

[Iain Christie]

I don't have the numbers.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

You must have an idea, though. Is it small; is it large?

[Iain Christie]

Well, it's obviously large, because it's a very large procurement. It's also very large for the Department of National Defence. Those fighter jets are an important part of our sovereignty and security, and they need to be replaced.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Okay.

Speaking of the aerospace sector, I had the pleasure of being with the Governor General down in Mexico to tour one of Bombardier's plants there and see the partnership between the two countries in the building of not just the Learjet, which is also built in the States, but also, I believe, the Challenger jet.

Can you see those types of partnerships expanding as we do more trade agreements around the world? How do they affect—?

[Iain Christie]

Yes, I think they are absolutely essential.

Our large aerospace companies will tell you that they need to expand globally in order to be competitive, and our small aerospace companies will tell you that they're looking forward to other people expanding into Canada to allow them to sell into the global supply chain.

Being global is not just a choice anymore; it's absolutely essential in the aerospace industry. The more we can do to pave the way for this and prepare industry to participate, the more we should do.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Okay.

When it comes to new technologies and their commercialization, are there any examples in the aerospace sector that you see as really good examples that we could draw on of seeing something go right from the drawing board or the brain to implementation?

[Iain Christie]

There are a number. They tend to be a bit involved, so they're probably not something I would take the committee's time with, but I can certainly provide examples of success stories of that kind.