I would add this. When I looked at social work I saw that the last time there was a sector study was in about 2005, I believe. It's not part of this submission but we have asked for and been looking at another sector study that looks at the number of social workers across Canada serving the populations. Independent of a caseload study, we'd be looking at how many social workers are actually there and actually providing services. Overwhelmingly, over 70% of the social workers surveyed say their caseloads are beyond their ability to manage, and we really have no national snapshot or standards when it comes to how many children should be on a caseload.
We can when it comes to Veteran Affairs. We can set national standards, which I think is 25:1. We can do that. I think it's time we actually started to put children first, if we're going to look at how to maintain children out of care. A report just came out of Manitoba today.