I'll come to Bev in a second.
There's no question in my mind, regardless of gender, that people who do equivalent work should be paid equivalently.
However, I want to look at the other side of it. What's the cost, in terms of more public servants, etc., to administer this? We have a new pay equity commissioner. We have three more people in another agency. Is there any desire within the federal government to balance that off by reducing public servants in other sectors? Are we going to add to the cost of administration in government?
I have a question for Mr. Graham with the Treasury Board, and maybe you can't answer this question, but I'll ask it anyway. It's a loaded question. I'll tell you that up front.
Could you tell me how many managers there are today versus front-line workers, compared to say, 10 years ago? What I'm seeing—and I'll tell you right up front—is that in the outlying areas, there's always a shortage of front-line workers, but Ottawa seems to grow a little bit with more managers. I'd like to see the workers.
In any event, can you answer that question, before I get astray here?