Evidence of meeting #184 for Finance in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was proposed.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Manuel Dussault  Senior Director, Framework Policy, Financial Sector Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Justin Brown  Director, Financial Stability, Financial Sector Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Peter Fragiskatos  London North Centre, Lib.
Yuki Bourdeau  Senior Advisor, Capital Markets Division, Financial Sector Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Eleanor Ryan  Director General, Financial Institutions Division, Financial Sector Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Jean-François Girard  Director, Consumer Affairs, Financial Institutions Division, Financial Sector Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Brigitte Goulard  Deputy Commissionner, Financial Consumer Agency of Canada
Kim Rudd  Northumberland—Peterborough South, Lib.
Mark Schaan  Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada
Ian Wright  Director, Financial Crimes Governance and Operations, Department of Finance
Darryl C. Patterson  Director, Corporate, Insolvency and Competition Policy Directorate, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Department of Industry
Martin Simard  Director, Copyright and Trademark Policy, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Department of Industry
Andrea Flewelling  Senior Policy Advisor, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Department of Industry
Patrick Blanar  Senior Policy Analyst, Patent Policy Directorate, Department of Industry
Dale MacMillan  Vice-President, Corporate Services and Chief Financial Officer, National Research Council of Canada
Christopher Johnstone  Director General, National Programs and Business Services, National Research Council of Canada
Eric Grant  Director, Community Lands Development, Lands and Environmental Management, Lands and Economic Development, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Leane Walsh  Director, Fiscal Policy and Investment Readiness, Economic Policy Development, Lands and Economic Development, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Susan Waters  Director General, Lands and Environmental Management Branch, Lands and Economic Development, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Michèle Govier  Senior Director, Trade Rules, International Trade and Finance Branch, Department of Finance
Katharine Funtek  Executive Director, Trade Controls Policy, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development
Bev Shipley  Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, CPC
Nicole Giles  Director, International Trade and Finance, Assistant Deputy Minister's Office, Department of Finance
Deirdre Kent  Director General, International Assistance Policy, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development
Mark Lusignan  Director General, Grants and contributions Management, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade (International Trade)
Michelle Kaminski  Director, Office of Innovative Finance, Grants and Contributions Management, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development
Chantal Larocque  Deputy Director, Development Finance, Grants and Contributions Financial Policy, Foreign Affairs Canada
Danielle Bélanger  Director, Gender-Based Analysis Plus and Strategic Policy, Policy and External Relations Directorate, Status of Women Canada
Alison McDermott  General Director, Economic and Fiscal Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Derek Armstrong  Executive Director, Results Division, Expenditure Management Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
Lori Straznicky  Executive Director, Pay Equity Task Team, Strategic Policy, Analysis and Workplace Information, Labour Program, Department of Employment and Social Development
Don Graham  Senior Advisor to the Assistant Deputy Minister, Compensation and Labour Relations Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
Bruce Kennedy  Manager, Pay Equity Task Team, Labour Program, Department of Employment and Social Development
Richard Stuart  Executive Director, Expenditure Analysis and Compensation Planning, Expenditure Management Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
Colin Spencer James  Senior Director, Social Development Policy, Strategic and Service Policy Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Andrew Brown  Director General, Employment Insurance Policy Directorate, Skills and Employment Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Barbara Moran  Director General, Strategic Policy, Analysis and Workplace, Labour Program, Department of Employment and Social Development
Rutha Astravas  Director, Employment Insurance Policy, Special Benefits Policy, Department of Employment and Social Development
Charles Philippe Rochon  Senior Policy Analyst, Labour Standards and Wage Earner Protection Program, Workplace Directorate, Department of Employment and Social Development

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

It's the same process, and it's roughly the same amount of time.

Right now, however, it should be noted that there is no registry of trademark agents. Because you can pursue a trademark on your own without the need of a trademark agent, the commissioner of trademarks, who in this case is also the the commissioner of patents, has no list of trademark agents before the office.

Sorry, Andrea, go ahead.

5:35 p.m.

Andrea Flewelling Senior Policy Advisor, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Department of Industry

I just want to clarify that there is actually a list of trademark agents.

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

There is a list, but it's not maintained by CIPO. Isn't that correct?

5:35 p.m.

Senior Policy Advisor, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Department of Industry

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

It is? Sorry, my bad.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

You mentioned that individual Canadians who are not agents can act for themselves in the pursuit of a trademark.

Is that also true for patents?

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

No.

We're just discussing whether or not you can prosecute it. You may be able to pursue it, but you can't prosecute it before the office.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

Can you file for a patent without a patent agent?

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

On the coming into force of this legislation, will you be able to do that, or will you require a patent agent?

5:35 p.m.

Patrick Blanar Senior Policy Analyst, Patent Policy Directorate, Department of Industry

It doesn't change the nature of who can do what in front of the office.

Anybody who can do something today in front of the office will be able to continue to do so. In the case of an agent, anything that is restricted to agent work continues to be so. It doesn't change the nature of who can appear before the office and when.

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

It doesn't take away the rights of an individual inventor to be able to pursue their patent, but the prosecution right still rests with agents.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

Right.

This really just makes it more strenuous.... I'm not even sure it's more strenuous, but it definitely creates a new process by which the licence to practise as a patent agent or trademark agent is secured.

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

Yes. It creates a new governance structure that essentially allows for a more robust governance regime.

As I say, right now there are limited powers. It's either on the list or off the list. This will expand the scope, allow for a series of other offences, and allow for an investigation committee, with due process, to be able to ensure that you can take up a complaint, or in the case of an agent, respond to a complaint about you in terms of inappropriate practice related to the code of conduct.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

Prior to this legislation, where would a complainant go? Was it to the commissioner?

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

It was to the commissioner.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

Could the complainant also take an action to court alleging malpractice, in the same way that I could if my mechanic doesn't screw my tire on properly and I go flying off the road?

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

Contract law would still apply, so you'd be able to—

November 5th, 2018 / 5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

No, it's not “would”. I'm asking about the status quo.

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

Can you? Yes.

Contract law would apply to the scenario of an individual claimant who has sought the services of an IP agent and is unhappy with that. Right now, they could potentially pursue that through the courts.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

Will the leadership of the college be elected by the licence holders?

5:35 p.m.

Director General, Marketplace Framework Policy Branch, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada

Mark Schaan

It's a mixed model, so I'll let Patrick explain.

5:35 p.m.

Senior Policy Analyst, Patent Policy Directorate, Department of Industry

Patrick Blanar

Because we want the college to also factor in the public interest, there will be a portion of the directors who will be nominated by the minister and a portion elected amongst patent agents or trademark agents.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Pierre Poilievre

How does that compare to, say, a college of physicians and surgeons, for example? Is it a similar appointment model?

5:35 p.m.

Senior Policy Analyst, Patent Policy Directorate, Department of Industry

Patrick Blanar

I can't speak to every college, but I know that in some cases, definitely it is.