Finance Committee on May 28th, 2019

[Jean-Pierre Morin]

It's more a question of changing the terms used in recent years, even last year. From the outset of consultations on the recognition of indigenous rights, First Nations, Inuit and Métis asked the government to change its use of those terms. It was during the drafting process that we realized that this text needed to be adapted.

[Pierre-Luc Dusseault, NDP, Sherbrooke, QC]

In the future, we will probably use the new term in all cases, instead of repeating the error.

[Jean-Pierre Morin]

That's right.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

I have a question.

INAC officials also appeared at the indigenous and northern affairs committee across the way. I know there are now two departments handling different sides of the indigenous file. One is services, and the other is more on the treaty side.

Aside from the impact of changing wording in the preamble, why didn't officials at committee there—and maybe you can't answer this; it's an open-ended question—itemize this? You said this is a long-standing thing, that the government has been changing from saying “recognition” to “affirmation”.

It has been a consistent request from aboriginal groups, Métis groups, indigenous groups and individuals. Why wasn't it caught over there? Why was it caught here instead?

[Jean-Pierre Morin]

That's a good question.

This issue was raised during the aboriginal peoples standing committee of the Senate, most specifically. There were several requests at that time to make that specific change. The decision was largely based on those hearings.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Is there any further discussion on Liberal amendment 12?

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

On Liberal-13, go ahead, Rachel.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Liberal amendment 13 also reflects testimony heard at the Senate Standing Committee on Aboriginal Peoples, to which the official just referred.

This amendment ensures clarity that the services and programs are also applicable to eligible indigenous governing bodies. By accepting the amendment, there will be clarity that the establishment of Indigenous Services Canada will not change or modify existing services, programs or policies provided by the department to indigenous governing bodies, and clarifies the scope of the services provided by the minister to include those services relating to the governance of indigenous governing bodies.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Is there any discussion, or any comments from officials on Liberal-13?

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

On Liberal amendment 14, go ahead, Mr. Lefebvre.

[Paul Lefebvre, Liberal, Sudbury, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

This amendment is in line with the other two amendments and is intended to establish some certainties in the proposed legislation.

In this case, we want to provide certainty that indigenous leaders will be eligible for services and programs. The proposed amendment provides greater certainty that the creation of Indigenous Services Canada will not change or modify the delivery of services and programs already provided by the department or the department's current policies with respect to indigenous governing bodies.

This amendment also clarifies that the minister's provision of services includes those related to the governance of indigenous governing bodies. This reflects one of the key priorities of indigenous partners, including the Assembly of First Nations. This proposed amendment also reflects the testimony heard by the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Is there any further discussion on this amendment?

(Amendment agreed to on division [See Minutes of Proceedings])

On Liberal-15, Mr. McLeod.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Mr. Chair, this amendment is to bring clarity that the annual report of the department will be based on a distinctions-based approach that will allow for comparison between indigenous groups and other Canadians. The amendment will ensure better reporting on the measures taken to address the socio-economic gaps by ensuring the particular needs and considerations of first nations, Inuit and Métis peoples.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Is there any further discussion?

[Pierre-Luc Dusseault, NDP, Sherbrooke, QC]

Is the use of the words “First Nations, Inuit, Métis” rather than “indigenous”, once again, the result of a new practice by the government's legislative drafters? Can we expect the word “indigenous”, which we are seeking to replace here with this amendment, to no longer be found in Canadian legislation at all and to always be replaced by those words?

[Jean-Pierre Morin]

Thank you for the question.

No. It was a specific request made to the Senate committee. The intent is not only to make a clear distinction between Inuit, First Nations and Métis, but also to ensure a comparison between the indigenous groups themselves.

[Pierre-Luc Dusseault, NDP, Sherbrooke, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Okay. Is everyone satisfied?

(Amendment agreed to on division [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(Clause 336 as amended agreed to on division)

There's a new clause 336.1, Liberal-16.

Mr. Fragiskatos.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

This amendment is required to add a new clause to fix the coming into force date for subdivision A to no later than July 15, 2019. This amendment ensures that the coming into force of this legislation is aligned with the consequential amendment relating to the transfer of appropriations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Are there any questions there?

Mr. Dusseault.

[Pierre-Luc Dusseault, NDP, Sherbrooke, QC]

The amendment proposes July 15 as the coming into force date. Without this amendment, what would the coming into force date be?

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Who can answer that question?

[Jean-Pierre Morin]

The coming into force date is set at royal assent. This allows an interval between the royal assent of the supply bill and the two acts creating departments, so that things are aligned with the supply bill.

[Pierre-Luc Dusseault, NDP, Sherbrooke, QC]

Okay, thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you for that.

Is there no further discussion on Liberal-16?

(Amendment agreed to on division [See Minutes of Proceedings])

We now have Liberal-17.

Mr. McLeod.

[Michael McLeod, Liberal, Northwest Territories, NT]

Mr. Chair, this one is also similar to the previous one. This amendment is required to add a new clause to fix the coming into force date for subdivision B to no later than July 15, 2019. This amendment ensures that the coming into force of this legislation is aligned with the consequential amendment relating to the transfer of appropriation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Are there any further thoughts or discussion on that?

(Amendment agreed to on division [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(On clause 337)

We have Liberal-18. Mr. McLeod.