It's gross debt, maybe, not net debt. Just in clarity, I was speaking net debt to GDP.
I mentioned that my preference for a fiscal anchor is the balanced budget; over the fiscal plan or slightly beyond the fiscal plan would be the ideal. I think the reality of what we're hearing more recently is that fiscal anchor has been altered and that now the preference is debt-to-GDP, which I suggested is not my preference, but that seems to be where we're headed. Then when you look at the debt-to-GDP ratio, there are some who would suggest not to even bother and let it run higher rather than let it run lower. My preference would be to continue to see it move lower for some of the reasons you've mentioned, that we do look just at federal government debt-to-GDP at 31% and hopefully declining. The federal government with their debt situation is in a better position on a net debt basis than most of the provinces, and the ability to stimulate the economy at a time when we need it.... Alberta, given their relative net asset position, is well positioned, and they seem to be going down that path as well, but most provinces Ontario and east have fiscal constraints upon them. Maybe Manitoba is on that list as well, but not quite as much, though.
I think the feds see that the debt-to-GDP ratio going down would be a preference. The first preference would be a balanced budget. But as for the debt-to-GDP, as I suggested, they have some control over the debt but no control over the GDP.