Finance Committee on April 4th, 2017

[Sandy Silver]

Oh, absolutely. In Yukon we're approaching an energy cliff, in a lot of ways. A lot of our energy is coming from hydro. In Whitehorse, with our hydro dam project, upwards of 95% of our power is from hydro. We do need to take into consideration, if any of these mining interests come to fruition, that we'll be in a situation where we'll have to make some major decisions as to how to supply our energy.

One of the benefits of self-governing agreements with the first nations is the ability to provide power for local communities on their own. We've had opportunities for windmills for Kluane First Nation. Tr’ondëk Hwëch’in in Dawson is taking a look at the “Yukon ditch”, which is such a fantastic provider of power it powered the Klondike gold rush into the dredging era. There's a massive amount of power being created.

Working with the first nations economic development branch, challenging our independent power production policies, and partnering in infrastructure building with Ottawa as they take a look at the national consideration in infrastructure—these are key questions and key conversations that we must have. I've had these conversations with the Minister of Infrastructure, Minister Sohi. To have that government-to-government-to-government conversation, where we're all at the table together, makes sense to the ministers, and I believe it expedites the conversations as well.

We're looking to remove power from our debt cap as well. The federal government will definitely have to help us out with that very important consideration.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

Mr. Liepert.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

Thank you, Premier.

I'm going to ask you about the potential for hydro. Is it something that could be exportable or are you simply too far removed and the cost would be prohibitive?

[Sandy Silver]

On the conversations about exporting power, we've only scratched the surface on that. I don't think our government has ever asked B.C., for example, if they'd want to buy power from Yukon. It's been a different conversation.

We've also, in my opinion, wasted some time and energy in the last exercise on next-generation hydro because we didn't consider the first nations traditional territories from the beginning. We ended up with a list of six major hydro production areas that didn't have the consent of the first nations whose traditional territories were going to be affected.

My current chief of staff spent 14 years as the president of the Yukon Energy Corporation, and this is a conversation that we have all the time. There are opportunities with Skagway, right next door, in terms of exporting power to Alaska. We have cruise ships that are coming up the harbour right now, docking, and using the diesel power. I believe it's illegal, but there's a consideration made because there's no alternative. There's an opportunity there for us. We definitely want to ask Canada again if there's consideration of a national energy grid and to have conversations about building that, now that B.C. is moving further north with their hydro lines and their hydro power considerations as well.

To answer your question, yes, but because it is pretty far, it does get expensive. There is a little bit of bleed-off with those distances, but it's a conversation that we're always willing to have.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

My only other question, then, would be on the fact that from a proximity standpoint, you probably share as much commonality with Alaska as you do with much of the rest of Canada. We clearly have an administration in Washington that is going in a much different direction than the administration in our country is. Do you see any negative spinoffs because of your interconnection with Alaska?

As an example, you mentioned road traffic. If the price of gasoline is more expensive in Yukon than it is in Alaska, do you run the risk of those motorhomes not filling up in Whitehorse and trying to make it a little further? Give me your thoughts on whether the two different directions economically could impact your territory.

[Sandy Silver]

On a completely high level, I believe, in terms of Canada's stance, when you take a look at the Paris agreement and moving forward from there, and at the commitment of the international community to tackle anthropomorphic climate change, I think Canada is in the right place at the right time and we're doing the right thing.

If you're an American travelling through Canada, you're going to complain about the dollar from the time you get to the border down in B.C. or Vancouver and all the way up. We hope that by the time you hit the Yukon-B.C. border, those complaints will be countered with the natural beauty of the experience and the people. There are always going to be considerations as far as the difference in price goes and how expensive it is in Canada versus the States in general.

I will say that the proximity to Alaska is actually a benefit to Yukon. That highway they travel on, the Shakwak Highway, that's from federal money from Washington that has dried up. I'm an optimist, and I hope that with the change in government we can have some conversations about making sure that money is reinstated so that we can maintain the highway in Canada that goes to Alaska to the standards they want. I'm looking forward to heading down to Washington in June, having conversations with the Council of the Federation, and letting Washington know the considerations and the benefits of having such close proximity to our Alaskan brothers and sisters.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thanks to both of you.

Mr. Ouellette, go ahead.

[Robert-Falcon Ouellette, Liberal, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I won't be long. I promise. I'll let you go. We'll finish up soon.

Thank you very much, Mr. Premier. I appreciate the opportunity to ask you a few questions.

I was wondering if you could talk a bit more about the Arctic Fibre network with Quintillion, which is going through the northern Arctic. Is the federal government currently investing in that at all?

[Sandy Silver]

When it comes to Arctic Fibre, that would be NWT's consideration, not Yukon's.

[Robert-Falcon Ouellette, Liberal, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I'm asking because there is a cable coming down through Alaska. The goal is to connect Japan to western Europe with a cable coming down through Alaska and then down the west coast all the way down to San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Seattle. I'm looking at this, and what I've heard about this project is that there is a need to allow a node of access in. It's not a lot of money, but so far I believe that the federal government is not actually investing in this. I've asked a couple of times at previous finance committee meetings in the pre-budget period. You were talking about trying to get Internet access, high-speed fibre optic access, through Alaska to ensure that you don't have to simply rely on the south, and I see this project, which is already actually being built right now. It could benefit you in Yukon and in the Northwest Territories and in Nunavut at some point, and even in Labrador and other communities up north, and really open up that opportunity for you.

[Sandy Silver]

Currently we are considering two routes. One is the Alaskan route, which would go through Juneau. We'd connect Whitehorse to Skagway, Alaska, through the South Klondike Highway. That's a connection that goes into Seattle, Washington.

The other application we are working with is the Dempster route, which would connect Dawson City to Inuvik along the Dempster Highway, a more northern and a Canadian connection, and that would connect to the Mackenzie Valley fibre line as well.

The final decision on the fibre line routes will consider the needs of Yukon residents as a whole and the business community as well as finding out where the federal money will come from for that. We have not picked a route yet. We're basically looking at the merits of both, and we know, honestly, at this point, Mr. Ouellette, that there are other considerations involved. It's a modern industry and it's always evolving. We're going to make sure that we make a decision that affects Yukoners and Yukon businesses taking into account considerations they have already identified for us.

[Robert-Falcon Ouellette, Liberal, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

You don't have a cost estimate for any of those projects?

[Sandy Silver]

It's always changing; that's for sure. There is nothing I would rely on right now.

[Robert-Falcon Ouellette, Liberal, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Okay, thanks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Do you have one question, Greg? You're the only one who hasn't had a chance.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Thank you very much, Premier.

I have just a very quick question. In your opening comments, you talked about how for Yukon Territory the GDP might not be the right measure for really measuring the health of the economy. You made the illustration regarding how the GDP in 2015 had shrunk by 6%, yet you saw retail trade grow by 5% and labour and employment remain the same.

If you were looking for a better measure or basket of measures, what would you like to see Statistics Canada use to better measure the health of Yukon Territory's economy?

[Sandy Silver]

It's a very good question. The GDP is a measure, but it's not the only measure, and when you look at the north, you really have to take into consideration these extenuating circumstances. Because we are northern, because we have such a small population with such a large geography, it's really hard to just look at GDP and to take a look at the fulsome picture of whether or not we are thriving from community to community.

Incomes per capita and the distribution of those incomes would be better, or would help paint a fuller picture, when we're looking at how prosperous Yukon is on a year-to-year basis.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

I do have one question, Premier. It relates to the regional economic development agency in your region, CanNor. We did meet with it early on in our pre-budget consultations.

As a federal economic development agency, is it doing what needs to be done? Are the processes appropriate in terms of involving your government and moving forward on economic development, and is the funding appropriate to do the job?

[Sandy Silver]

It's a simple question yet one that's hard to answer. You don't want to bite the hand that feeds you. That's for sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

But we need to know the facts.

[Sandy Silver]

It's like any institution; everything needs assessment and needs to make sure it's working as efficiently as possible. I would say we are happy with CanNor. We're happy with the representation. We believe that there's an easy connect. It's very easy for my office to reach out to the personnel in the offices, and we have a great rapport there.

I think we need to do a better job in Yukon of identifying community-to-community needs, to make sure that the lists that are given to us by municipalities and first nations governments.... When those lists are collected by the territorial government, we need to partner as a one-government approach and then focus into Ottawa and say that these are our priorities. I think we need to do a better job of making sure that the items that get to Ottawa are the ones that started on that list and are prioritized based upon the individual needs of the communities.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

With that, Premier, we'll thank you for your presentation, and committee members for their questions. Thank you very much.

Committee, I have one other thing before we adjourn. I mentioned earlier that the Minister of Finance would be willing to come on Monday, April 10. If it's fine with committee members, he has confirmed that he would appear from 3:30 to 4:30 on the budget and the main estimates. Department officials would attend for the second hour on the main estimates, and the minister would appear at a later date on the budget implementation act. Are we okay with that?

[Some hon. members]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

One other thing not related to committee business is that today is a special day for someone. It's somebody's birthday who works with the committee. Suzie's birthday is today. Seeing as we're the finance committee and the Conservatives are always putting the pressure on not to spend too much money, we didn't dare go and get a whole cake. I have a piece of a cake.

Suzie, happy birthday.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Mr. Chair, I feel obliged to point out that I've known you for over 20 years, and, Suzie, I can assure you that he has had no other excuse for getting just a piece of cake in every other year.