Evidence of meeting #45 for Finance in the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was sir.
A video is available from Parliament.
Founder, WE Charity
We love spending time with you, sir, but at some point that would be lovely.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
Okay, we're going to do it in about 25 more minutes.
Ms. May, you have two and a half minutes, and then Mr. Cumming.
Green
Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I really appreciate this.
To correct the record, I've known both Marc and Craig Kielburger for years. I don't say this because I'm angry with you over it, but I do need to correct that you've never asked the Green Party to anything. You've never asked me to be a speaker. At this point I don't know whether I really want to thank you for that, but....
Green
Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC
I do want to get to a serious question, though. I was very impressed, of course, with Michelle Douglas. I know her as well. I'm a huge fan of hers. I do get concerned with board governance issues. In the future I think you may want to look at your role as founders, which I think Mr. Barrett raised earlier. When you look on the website, you have founders, staff, the board of directors. It's a bit murky as a governance question.
Ms. Douglas told us she gave three reasons for her resignation. One of them was that she couldn't get answers from you, Marc, as to why you went to Kenya twice in a period of time when the organization was in considerable difficulties.
Can you explain it to the committee? Only because she thinks it's highly significant, I need to ask you, why did you go to Kenya twice and why didn't you give her the information as to why you went?
Founder, WE Charity
Of course, Ms. May, thank you. Out of all of this, we appreciate your kind compliments at the beginning as well.
Very quickly, of course going back three months ago, the world was topsy-turvy. I had a prescheduled trip to go to Kenya to help work with the organization. Then a handful of days later, when the pandemic really started to begin in earnest very significantly, we saw governments closing borders and shutting things down.
We literally had dozens of young people on international volunteer trips overseas. We had Canadian and American staff who were literally stuck, who could have been stuck overseas. Some ended up being in a very difficult position. We had to get them out.
As a leader of the organization, I said I needed to continue to give assistance. Even though I'd just come back, the situation began to rapidly unfold. I was only back in Kenya for 24 more hours, at the request of the team, to be of assistance where possible and to help ensure that the organization would be fine, but most importantly that our people would be fine. I was doing my very best.
I may not have articulated that under the circumstances, a very stressful time, but I was there for our people.
Green
Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC
Were you able to get Canadians home as a result of your trip there? By staying home, I got a lot of people home to Canada on Zoom and calling all the right people and embassies and high commissions in the middle of the night. Did you physically have to go there to get people home?
Founder, WE Charity
Ms. May, as a member of Parliament you probably have much more influence than we do in these cases. We had dozens of young people there on the team—a very complicated situation. I was there for less than 24 hours. Yes, we were able to get people home.
Founder, WE Charity
If I may clarify, some of the senior team in Kenya were themselves refusing to leave because they were arranging the medical response. We have a hospital there that treats over 800,000 people in a region. We have a medical college. Marc went in to also make the medical arrangements on the ground so that our local leaders, who are expats, would have the confidence to return home as part of this evacuation.
It was a very difficult choice. We respect Michelle Douglas's transition. The other directors transitioned in a different way—let me just keep stressing that—but we respect Michelle Douglas's choice in the matter. We understand why she made the choice.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
Okay.
We'll go to Mr. Cumming, and back to five-minute rounds.
James, the floor is yours, and you'll be followed with two minutes by Mr. Fortin and then Ms. Koutrakis.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the two witnesses for appearing on this very important issue.
You began with incurring “eligible expenses” on May 5, more than two months before signing the contribution agreement. Who in the government told you before May that those expenses would be eligible for reimbursement?
Founder, WE Charity
Sir, it's a very good question.
We put our hand up to be of assistance, because the date initially on which this program would be launching would be early June. This was done in coordination with ESDC. We had many phone calls with them and their team, and specifically Rachel Wernick, who was very much aware that we were working very significantly on this project throughout the entire month.
Founder, WE Charity
However, I know I said it, but allow me to say it again, that although we started working on May 5, we were aware that despite our building a network in support, if the contract were not signed, we would not be reimbursed. We took that risk on in full knowledge ourselves.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Specifically, when did you receive that from Wernick? What day?
Founder, WE Charity
That was a conversation we started to have. It was close to the 4th or 5th. It was in that ballpark.
Founder, WE Charity
If I could, we were often having daily conversations with ESDC at that time—many conversations a week—in coordination with negotiating the contract with the organization and the organization's teams together. It was very much a coordinated effort, sir.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Was there an email that told you which expenses were eligible?
Founder, WE Charity
The eligible expenses are deeply outlined in the contract through an extraordinary amount of detail.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Which came out two months later.
Which ministers did either of you or your intermediaries communicate with in March? Who were they, and what was the date?
Founder, WE Charity
No minister, to our knowledge, were we in touch with in March at all, sir.
Conservative
Founder, WE Charity
To my knowledge, looking at the timeline provided to me by my team and staff, the only touchpoint was with ESDC civil servants on March 6 when there was a comprehensive service learning white paper presented as per their request. That was with civil servants.
Founder, WE Charity
That's to the best of our knowledge, of course, under the circumstances.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Okay. Among the minister's staff members, whom did you communicate with in March and at what date, or can you provide that at a later date?