Evidence of meeting #51 for Finance in the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was youth.
A video is available from Parliament.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Do you think that could have been expanded, particularly with the programs you have, to have more youth involved with it, if there was the capacity within the program dollar-wise?
4:50 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
Yes, there is always room for expansion. We never serve 100% of the youth that we wish to serve, if I could answer it that way. At some point, we understand that governments have budgets of their own and that there is a lot of work to be done. We do the best we can to argue for the dollars we need, and I want to use the word “fight”, in a way. We fight for every line item in terms of our negotiations with ESDC and other government departments, but we realize that's the right thing to do and appropriate.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Since this program was cancelled, has anyone reached out to you or picked up the phone to talk to you about a go-forward path and taking advantage of the 40-some years of experience on what's next, what we could do?
4:50 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
No, not in that context. We've been told that the government is looking at potentially a different way of doing this. We've essentially been asked to just wait a little longer before they come back to us and let us know what that is.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
James Cumming Conservative Edmonton Centre, AB
Well, I suggest that hopefully they will pick up the phone and talk to you because we are running out of time. These students want to get back to school. I would encourage my friends across the aisle to pick up the phone and have that dialogue with you.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
All right. Thank you, all.
We have Mr. Fraser, followed by.... I don't have anybody next on my CPC list, so somebody send me a note or be prepared to go.
Mr. Fraser.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS
Thank you so much, Mr. Chair. Thank you to our witness for being here and, more importantly, thank you for the work that you do.
I had the opportunity early in my career to take part, not in Katimavik but through a program administered by the Canadian Bar Association, in work for a human rights organization in South Africa. I have to say that kind of service opportunity was life-changing, to say the least. I know you've had a remarkable impact on the lives of other young people.
I see a parallel between the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the Canada student service grant and certain cuts that were made to Katimavik's programming back in 2012. I want to give full credit to my colleague Mr. McLeod, who is on this committee, who repeatedly brings up the well-being and the interests of the students who were hoping to take part in this program.
Building on questions he's asked from previous meetings, I'm wondering if you can describe a little bit what the impact was for the students who had been planning on taking part in the program in 2012, and whether you think that the consequences for the students who were hoping to take part in your programming this summer to be similar. What would be the impact on them? Maybe part B to the question is how we can get things back on track for them.
4:55 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
To answer your second question first, just so I can circle back, I think there's a wonderful opportunity here. There are a number of charities within the Canada service corps, very stellar organizations and very good non-profit and charitable organizations as members of the CSC, and I think that's a good source of.... It's almost a de facto advisory committee, if we're called upon to do that, to help navigate some of the more strategic goals of the previous grant program. We could participate in that discussion to help sort it out and come up with some ideas on how best to do that.
I'll have to ask you to repeat your first question. I've forgotten it.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS
Katimavik in 2012 went through a serious budget cut at the time. I know that the impact on students who were planning to take part would have been severe. I'm curious to know whether you can describe what position it would have put the students in and whether students who were hoping to take part this year are facing similar circumstances.
4:55 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
As a result of the timeline, we weren't going to actually engage in any activity until that renegotiated agreement was signed. In Katimavik's case, although we had restructured the staffing to be able to support the program, we hadn't executed yet on bringing young people into it. We just felt that wasn't appropriate until we crossed the t's and dotted the i's on the final agreement.
I will say to you that students, as I think all members of Parliament across the board know, are really hard hit in this time related to COVID. I think we should do everything we can to make sure we provide some sort of support to them before it's too late, so that they can continue their education.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS
One of the things I'm interested in, and it's also a point raised with frequency by Mr. Julian, is the compensation model. It was really a tuition credit to inspire more students to take up volunteerism.
I mentioned the opportunity I had near the beginning of my career. One of the reasons I ended up going with that program was that there was some compensation. Although it wasn't enough to really pay off all the student debt I'd built up, it was better than opportunities with other international organizations that were sometimes altogether year-long unpaid internships.
I'm curious to know whether you think the compensation built into the Canada student service grant would have allowed you to recruit more students and would have helped them with the cost of going to school.
4:55 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
Absolutely. I know there's been some debate about volunteerism versus remuneration for that, but I think the added benefit in this case is that charities were very hard hit across the board across the country. They needed more help and assistance than necessarily a volunteer corps committed solely to pure volunteerism might have been able to provide them. This would have been access to almost a whole new group of young people who could have stepped up.
Speaking to the experience you referenced, there are other added benefits that come out of that kind of service. They leave those programs committed to community capacity building, with a greater understanding of the various regions of the country. They feel more connected to the country. They build bonds and friendships with Canadians of diversity, which they otherwise would not have had an opportunity to do. I think the net return on the investment would have been more, in fact, than just providing jobs. We would have had a group of young people come out with a far deeper connection to Canada and a commitment to continue.
In 2016, I believe, Katimavik called upon Leger to run a poll. It showed that 88% of Canadians at that time believed in these kinds of programs, understood the benefit to them and wanted them supported. Again, I think this was a creative and innovative way in a particular crisis to solve a number of issues.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
This will be your last question, Mr. Fraser, and then we'll go to Mr. Cooper.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS
Excellent. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I'll just build upon that question. One of the things I found very frustrating when I was finishing up my master's program and looking at these opportunities was that I found that a number of the people who could afford to go for a year, and sometimes two years, in these high-profile unpaid internships with international organizations came from families of significant financial means.
I'm curious to know whether you think the combination of the Canada emergency student benefit, which many of the students would have qualified for, or the Canada emergency response benefit, for that matter, with the additional tuition supplement would have been able to help recruit low-income students who otherwise may not have been able to afford to take part in a program that would have been purely volunteer-based and not compensating them at all.
5 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
I would agree with that.
As I said in a previous question or in my remarks, we did reach out to the minister to offer one suggestion, which was to maybe look at the potential of not only supporting post-secondary education students, who many believe, rightfully or wrongly, are privileged to begin with.... I'm not arguing that's the case. I'm just saying that can be the perception.
There is a whole segment of youth who don't feel that they have access to higher training and education and skills development. I think there's a real opportunity here to provide them with that kind of support as well. That might encourage them, through training and higher education, to conceive of things they otherwise would not have conceived of. It doesn't have to be post-secondary. There are all sorts of skills training and so forth that they could access.
I think it's an opportunity for all youth, regardless of economic background, to be able to dream a little brighter and step up to get some training that will help achieve their goals.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS
Thank you so much. I sincerely appreciate your advice and feedback.
5 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
Thank you, both.
We have two more five-minute slots. We will start with Mr. Cooper and end the round with Mr. McLeod.
Mr. Cooper.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Thank you, Chair.
Mr. Cameron, when was the first time that Katimavik became aware of the CSSG?
5 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
It would have been in a call, the date of which I don't recall. It would have been in a call I'm going to assume was at some point in April. We were told there was going to be a program specific to students, that the government had partnered with a third party provider, and that we would be brought into the conversation as the program developed to determine what role our organization in particular could play in mapping that out.
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Conservative
Michael Cooper Conservative St. Albert—Edmonton, AB
Okay.
Other than the call you had on April 15, or thereabouts, with ESDC, there had been no other communications with ESDC about student programming in this particular context, and more specifically the CSSG, until some time after, I presume April 22. That's what you're saying, just in terms of establishing a timeline.
August 13th, 2020 / 5 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Katimavik
I don't remember the April 15 date. That's what I want to check and get back to you on, just to make sure.
5 p.m.
Conservative