Finance Committee on April 1st, 2021

[Donna Lee Demarcke]

Thank you, Mr. Johns, for bringing up ITAC. I was kicking myself for not mentioning them earlier. They're vital to our industry. Again, they're in the same situation. Without having the certainty of knowing what's going on, people are looking elsewhere. Employees are leaving. The whole structure of the organization crumbles without knowing what the certainty is.

Again, the supports, and to know what's actually happening and what's going to be happening down the road, are vital and critical to our sector.

I can't speak to an election call. I'm sorry.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

We'll turn to five-minute rounds and Mr. Poilievre, followed by Ms. Dzerowicz.

Mr. Poilievre, go ahead.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Ms. Morton, you said you always sent correspondence to Mr. Kielburger for his review before sending it out, so when you sent the message “Hello Ben, Thank you for your kindness in helping shape our latest program with the gov't. Warmly, Craig” to Mr. Kielburger, did he object to that wording going to Mr. Chin?

[Victoria Morton]

As I mentioned in my statement, I don't recall the details or specifics of sending this message.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

You don't remember sending the message.

[Victoria Morton]

There were 100-plus of them, so no, I don't remember this specific one.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

You just don't remember sending it.

[Victoria Morton]

Correct.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Did you send messages to any other members of the government—staff, bureaucrats or politicians—among the 100?

[Victoria Morton]

I can't recall the names that were specifically on that list, but I remember that there were other government people within the 100. I don't know if they were staffers or not.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Did you thank any of them for shaping the program?

[Victoria Morton]

That's where we get into my memory from a year ago. We're relying on my memory here, so....

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Fine. However, when Craig looked at the message you proposed to send to Mr. Chin, he didn't have any objections. You don't remember any objections on his part.

[Victoria Morton]

I don't recall any objections on his part. I also said that I don't know if he always reviewed it.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Then you would send things with his name on them, without him even knowing what the words were.

[Victoria Morton]

That has happened on occasion, yes.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Okay. How did you know that Ben Chin helped shape the Canada student service grant?

[Victoria Morton]

I wouldn't have had visibility into that.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

How did you know?

[Victoria Morton]

Well, similar to the conversation we were having with Mrs. Jansen, I would put together the best information I could with the information I had available, making assumptions as I went. Again, though, I didn't have visibility into that sort of thing. I would think—

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Did you write the words “Hello Ben, Thank you for your kindness in helping shape our latest program with the gov't”? Did you write those words?

[Victoria Morton]

Once again, asking the same question in a different way doesn't really refresh the memory at all.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Okay, but Craig is claiming that you sent it, and now you're saying you can't remember if you sent it.

[Victoria Morton]

Because then I wouldn't be relying on my explicit memory of exactly where I was, when it was, what my thought process was, in sending that message, and I sent 100 of them a year ago.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Right, but you did send the message.

Sorry, I'm just not clear. You did send it, or you don't know if you sent it. Where are we at?