Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Pardon me, but I'm starting off with a sip of water. I hope you don't mind. Thank you.
We're debating the subamendment to the amendment to the main motion that touches on privilege.
The way we got here began initially with my colleague, Ms. Dzerowicz, putting a motion on the table to conduct pre-budget consultations. Mr. Chair, you've made clear to this committee that if we're going to do that, we need to do them fairly quickly, because the Standing Orders allow us to do them, but only allow us to table a report prior to the end of this year—a few days before the House rises for Christmas.
Mr. Poilievre jumped in with a privilege motion which relates to the document production surrounding the WE Charity controversy. There were a couple of problems with the initial privilege motion that relate to the subamendment. The problems had to do with the sort of oddities that surrounded the government's initial delivery of documents to members of the committee, and specifically how they were uploaded. The government, as we got near prorogation, delivered the information to critics on USBs, and at a similar point in time, the documents were being uploaded, but not all of them were uploaded. In any event, they have not officially made it before this committee.
The initial privilege motion, you'll recall, failed to bring documents from the previous Parliament into the privilege motion, which I believe you ruled was out of order as a result, but a majority of the members of the committee overturned that particular decision that you took.
In an effort to remedy the evidentiary issue, an amendment to the motion was put forward that sought to bring some, but not all, of the documents that the government produced into the record. That's still a problem, because the documents that were not included in the proposed amendment were the very documents that explained why the redactions existed. Those documents include the remittal letters, which I've spoken about at length before this committee, which largely outlined a couple of reasons for the redactions that have taken place.
Generally speaking, and I think this is very important.... I've seen a number of members of the opposition draw attention to the Speaker's ruling indicating that the committee can review the documents and decide what to do with them. The committee is jumping into an assumption, or at least certain members appear to be jumping into an assumption, that privilege has been breached without having actually reviewed the records. I think the very least we should do, if we're going to take this back to the Speaker, is the bare minimum that he suggested we do by actually reviewing the documents.
Of course, we have gone through great lengths to try to get some of these documents onto the record if they are not already there. One of the problems that remains has to do with the fact that the explanation behind the redactions are not in place.
In order to help remedy this defect, the subamendment tried to do a couple of different things. In fact, this is I think the third subamendment that we've tried to have to help remedy this problem. The first one would have required a comparison of the two complete sets of documents that were produced. The second subamendment had to do with adding page annotations so we could quickly understand the differences between what's on the record and what the government actually produced—both of which were defeated. The third and final subamendment is the one we are debating now.
The subamendment before us seeks to do a couple of things. Largely, its purpose is to prepare two complete sets of documents so we can understand which redactions the government was responsible for and which redactions the law clerk was responsible for. Then we would have the opportunity to review those documents on the evidentiary record that is before this committee in this session of Parliament. That would allow us to understand, with a greater degree of confidence in fact, what the government has produced and whether it has met the obligations that were outlined in the initial motion.
There are other problems with the motion specifically around the issue of cabinet confidence, both whether we requested the documents and whether the request that has been made has been satisfied. First, on the issue of incomplete disclosure, the opposition's privilege motion and associated amendment are seeking to bury the explanations that the government has provided for why the redactions exist. I think at a bare minimum we should allow the remittal letters into the record so we can understand the very clear explanation that has been given but the opposition refuses to allow on the evidentiary record before this committee.
An offer has recently come in from the Clerk of the Privy Council, who has specifically asked to testify, or at least he has made known his intention or willingness to be available at this committee's behest to give evidence on the record as to why certain redactions were made. I think we would benefit from this. If any of the members of the opposition, although we're debating the subamendment now, are willing to have the Clerk of the Privy Council come and testify as he has indicated, I would be more than happy to be interrupted, because I think that would allow us to make some headway here. However, seeing no interjections, I will continue. Perhaps that will be a debate on a further subamendment, because if we're going to make a decision as to whether we should take up the Clerk on that invitation, those who are opposed should make it known on the record.
The issue, though, around incomplete disclosure really has to do with the principle that's foundational to parliamentary democracy, and that's due process. It infiltrates every element of our democracy, whether it's our criminal justice system in Canada or whether it's our ordinary parliamentary discourse. Indeed the foundations of responsible government depend on the opportunity to ask a question and give an answer. Here we have opposition members who are insisting that they ask a question, provide the answer themselves and shut out everyone else from having an opportunity to give an explanation. That doesn't sound like fair process to me. It sounds highly inappropriate.
Perhaps I'll explain the cabinet issue and return in detail to the shortcomings on the incomplete disclosure that I've been on so far. The cabinet documents issue is really a core sticking point. It's really important that cabinet confidences be protected, but before we even get there in this analysis, I think it's worth revisiting the initial motion.
The whole basis of the allegation that privilege has been violated is that the government failed to meet the conditions outlined in the committee's motion that was adopted in July, which members of the governing party supported at the time, I recall. There's an important reason why we supported the motion even though, frankly, we would rather get on with the business of pre-budget consultations, because I know I'm getting requests in my own community and across Canada to appear.
In any event, the motion that was adopted by the finance committee in the previous session of this Parliament reads as follows:
That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(1)(a), the Committee order that any contracts concluded with We Charity and Me to We, all briefing notes, memos and emails, including the contribution agreement between the government and the organization, from senior officials prepared for or sent to any Minister regarding the design and creation of the Canada Student Service Grant—