Thank you. I'm sorry. I'm not sure if I understood the question correctly, but as far as I understood, I think you were specifically speaking to the enforcement piece, which is the ability of borrowers to prosecute lenders.
We believe that enforcement needs to go hand in hand. We know that with the way it is at this point in the Criminal Code of Canada it's very hard to prosecute these lenders because one needs an actuarial certificate. Our submission has been that the enforcement piece needs to be strengthened at the same time as we are doing this.
Also, there is one more element to this, which is that a lot of these lenders have been adding insurance and other products, so 60% is the maximum rate but then, on top of it, lenders can add insurance and other products that actually take the interest rate much higher than 60%. Donna is here today. She had an installment loan from CitiFinancial at the time and when she went to CitiFinancial, they said do whatever you want; nobody can touch us.
This is really problematic because lenders think that nobody can prosecute them. The problem is that the enforcement needs to be strengthened as we are moving towards the lowering of criminal interest rates, because those go hand in hand.