Finance Committee on May 7th, 2024

Evidence of meeting #142 for Finance in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was budget.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

Subject matter of Bill C-69, An Act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on April 16, 2024
Committee Business

MPs speaking

Peter Fonseca
Adam Chambers
Patrick Weiler
Gabriel Ste-Marie
Don Davies
Philip Lawrence
Ryan Turnbull
Julie Dzerowicz
Marty Morantz
Dan Albas
Jasraj Singh Hallan
Damien Kurek
Laila Goodridge
Joanne Thompson
Yvan Baker
Chrystia Freeland
Arielle Kayabaga
Jamil Jivani
Charlie Angus
Mike Lake
Garnett Genuis
Arnold Viersen
Matthew Green

Also speaking

Lindsay Gwyer  Director General, Legislation, Tax Legislation Division, Tax Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Peter Repetto  Senior Director, International Tax, Department of Finance
Gervais Coulombe  Acting Director General, Sales Tax Division, Department of Finance
Pierre Leblanc  Director General, Personal Income Tax Division, Tax Policy Branch, Department of Finance
Christopher Bowen  Director General, Benefit Programs Directorate, Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency
Adnan Khan  Director General, Business Returns Directorate; Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency
Maximilian Baylor  Director General, Business Income Tax Division, Department of Finance
David Messier  Director, International Taxation Section, Business Income Tax Division, Department of Finance
Tyler Minty  Director, Industrial Decarbonisation Taxation, Department of Finance
Priceela Pursun  Director General, International and Large Business Directorate, Compliance Programs Branch, Canada Revenue Agency
Clerk of the Committee  Mr. Alexandre Roger

1 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

On a point of order, I would like to ask the chair if he can clarify with the clerk what advice the chair was given for the conduct of our meeting in terms of starting the meeting. My understanding is that the clerk gave the advice that the previous meeting was suspended and that this meeting should start on the subamendment the Conservatives introduced in a previous meeting, which is on a motion regarding the rest of our schedule between now and June.

For clarity, could the clerk share with the chair what advice the clerk has given the chair?

1 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

We'll suspend the meeting for now.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Colleagues, having just consulted the clerk, I would like to advise members that any discussions between the chair and the clerk are confidential. There was advice given, and we are continuing, pursuant to Standing Order 106(4), the matter that was brought forward today. That is what we just discussed.

Mr. Chambers, you may continue.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Adam Chambers Conservative Simcoe North, ON

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

I have a point of order, Chair.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Adam Chambers Conservative Simcoe North, ON

Mr. Chair, before we do a point of order, can I get a ruling on the attire that's required at a committee meeting, please?

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Mr. Chambers, in committees, there are no attire requirements.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Adam Chambers Conservative Simcoe North, ON

Okay. Thank you.

2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

Are we back to the point of order, Chair?

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Go ahead, Mr. Turnbull.

May 17th, 2024 / 2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

Chair, have you made a ruling as to how to proceed based on the way you've opened up today's committee meeting? My understanding is that, based on the last meeting having been suspended, the clerk's advice was to start this meeting on what was suspended previously, which was the motion I introduced that was then amended and subamended by the Conservatives. What I'd like to know is what your ruling was on that, given the advice you received from the clerk.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON

On that point of order, I think we have a very important study. Mr. Chambers is introducing a critical motion to study a problem that is costing Canadians hundreds of billions of dollars, inflating housing prices and aiding in the trafficking of fentanyl. I think this is a very serious matter, and I'm very troubled that the Liberals don't seem to want to have a discussion.

2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

Could I speak to that point of order, Chair?

2:10 p.m.

Bloc

Gabriel Ste-Marie Bloc Joliette, QC

On a point of order, as well, Mr. Chair, there is no interpretation when Mr. Turnbull is speaking.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Mr. Turnbull, there is no interpretation. I think there were some issues with your audio before as well. I'm not sure if that's been addressed.

2:10 p.m.

A voice

No.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

It has still not been addressed.

Mr. Turnbull, your audio is still causing issues for the interpreters. That's why there is no interpretation from your end.

I'll look to Mr. Ste-Marie. Is that going to continue to be an issue for you? I'm seeing yes. Thank you.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON

I have a point of order.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Just one second, Mr. Lawrence.

I talked with the clerk, and he makes a good point that there may be people listening to the interpretation from across the country, Mr. Turnbull. Since your audio is not clear, it may be difficult for those who are tuning in online across Canada to hear the interpretation, which is the issue that Mr. Ste-Marie brought up.

2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Arielle Kayabaga Liberal London West, ON

I'm sorry, but I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Go ahead, Ms. Kayabaga.

2:10 p.m.

Liberal

Arielle Kayabaga Liberal London West, ON

Thank you.

I'm not a permanent sitting member of this committee. I'm just visiting today, but I'm a member of other permanent committees, and when there's an audio issue we usually suspend to try to resolve that issue.

For the sake of all colleagues who are here who have taken their time on a Friday in a non-sitting week to be at this committee meeting, can we just take time to suspend to figure out MP Turnbull's audio issue? He is using the appropriate devices that we're required to use, and I think we should give him a fair chance to participate.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON

I have a point of order.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Jasraj Singh Hallan

Go ahead, Mr. Lawrence.

2:10 p.m.

Conservative

Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON

The Liberals had the opportunity, just as we did, to be here in person. Conservatives have chosen to have a member here in person. They have chosen not to.

If they're unable to fill the basic tenets of the requirement to log on appropriately, other members are able to speak, presumably. For Mr. Turnbull, just as in Parliament in general, if you're not in your seat, it's not the responsibility of the rest of the committee to take care of that.