Finance Committee on Nov. 7th, 2024

[David Clarke]

I don't have statistics, but yes, they're everyday people.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

They're everyday people trying to take a risk to help Canada out, and themselves and their families. Is that correct?

[David Clarke]

Yes. They're people who believe in these companies and technologies. They want to see them succeed. They're also the employees of these companies a lot of the time, as mentioned.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Mr. Clarke, TMX is involved in Canadian energy markets. Is that correct?

[David Clarke]

Yes.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Will the emissions cap the government recently announced have an effect on the growth of energy markets here in Canada?

[David Clarke]

It's a new policy, and that's a forward-looking question. I'm not an economist.

What I can tell you is that I would be happy to provide stats to the clerk, for the benefit of the committee, that look back 15 or 20 years. We've seen the trend in investments in Canada's energy sector decline over time. Twenty years ago, it was billions of dollars, in the high teens to low twenties. This year, it might not top a billion.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

We now go to MP Thompson.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Thank you.

I'm sorry I'm not there in person. I certainly hope to get a few questions in with different witnesses.

Thank you all for joining us.

I will begin with you, Ms. Crocker.

I found your second recommendation very interesting. It really resonated with me when you spoke about the need to have some ability to be fluid in the funding stream so that you can be reactive and adjust programs to meet needs, which.... I've worked in the sector. I think it is incredibly realistic.

How do we do that, as a government? Accountability is so important in terms of ensuring outcomes are met. Obviously, the need in the sector is quite significant. How do we create a space where organizations can be fluid in how a program moves through the system and also speak to outcome so that there's a clear line?

Indeed, by being fluid, you're able to achieve those outcomes in a very tangible way.

[Katie Crocker]

Thank you. That's a great question. It's something we've put a lot of thought into over the decades we've been doing this work.

I think there are a couple of ways.

One way is around monitoring frameworks. I'll give you the example of salaries.

If we're funded by the federal government, they can say, “We'll pay for staff and the salary for each position, so you need to present us with a salary grid. Then you can set your salaries into that grid, and it's up to you, as the organization, to move people along that grid—up, down or wherever they belong within the grid.” That's approving and setting the framework, but it's not getting into the micromanagement of each salary for each individual staffer.

That's not what's happening for us right now. What's happening in our sector is that we need to have every salary for every person approved. If that person gets a salary increase because they've been at the organization for a year and there's a merit increase, we have to go back to the federal government and put in an amendment for approval to have that person get a 2% salary bump.

We're not asking to be totally haphazard within these amounts. What we're asking for is the approval of a framework so we can then be more fluid in the way we deliver our services.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Thank you.

It's interesting. I'm on the other side of the country and the other coast and I hear the same thing, so I really appreciate your clarifying that.

Because I am from Newfoundland and Labrador, and we love our live music, I will switch to you, Ms. Benjamin. I really enjoyed reading your recommendations to the committee.

I want to jump on tourism-focused programs for a moment.

Could you speak about how this recommendation for us in the budget could also align with existing or expanded tourism programs and funding? I'm thinking of Newfoundland and Labrador, for example. There were announcements very recently on elevating the tourism experience in Atlantic Canada. One of those was around the culinary experience. We could raise the bar in terms of more local fresh food availability, especially when you leave the urban area and move to a rural area.

Can you speak about how you see—if you do indeed see—this tourism-focused program aligning with existing programs in areas around the country?

[Erin Benjamin]

Are you asking about the festival program in our submission and how it could align with existing tourism initiatives in the province?

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Basically, I am, yes. How would collaborating with tourism-related organizations really expand the outcome?

[Erin Benjamin]

I think that is happening to a certain extent through the tourism growth program. However, our recommendation is suggesting dedicated and increased festival funding.

I think the opportunity exists for collaboration and partnership across the country, actually. Newfoundland and Labrador is a great example of remarkable live music and celebration, with amazing fans and artists. It was actually COVID that brought us closer together than ever in collaboration between the live music and festival community and the tourism sector. It sounds strange today, because we work together almost non-stop at this point, but it's a relatively recent relationship.

Where there are existing programs, I would urge local industry to work directly with the destination organizations and the RTOs—the regional tourism organizations—to see where the programs align and how they can collaborate most effectively to maximize the investments there and also to make the arguments for future investments because, as I'm here to say, they're exponential, and policy will prove that out.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Thank you, MP Thompson. That is time.

Now we'll go to MP Ste-Marie, please.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Ross and Mr. St‑Roch, in two and a half minutes, can you explain your requests or recommendations to us about the AgriRecovery and AgriStability programs?

[Charles-Félix Ross]

Okay.

By the way, we also love music in Quebec.

AgriStability is the first safety net for farmers. It works relatively well, but it takes a very long time to get the help it's intended to provide. In the event of natural disasters and exceptional losses, this program doesn't sufficiently cover businesses. When the process starts after a weather event or climate crisis, farmers need to demonstrate to our provincial government and the federal government that they've sustained major losses.

Then AgriRecovery, a program to address disasters, comes into play, which initiates a whole bureaucratic process. For example, before gaining access to the AgriRecovery program, some produce growers had to wait for the provincial and federal governments to reach an agreement after more than 24 meetings. The assistance for them provided under this program will be paid out in 2025, almost a year and a half after the events took place.

What we're asking for is better support under AgriStability, especially in the event of major climate events. We want to improve the program by increasing the coverage rate to 85% of the reference margin—these are technical terms—which is what it used to be. We're also asking that the response be much quicker on farms in the event of major issues.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette, QC]

Thank you.

My time is almost up.

In one of your recommendations, you suggest that the government amend the accessibility criteria for the new incentive for Canadian entrepreneurs to reflect the reality of farming businesses. Can you very quickly say a few words about that?

[Charles-Félix Ross]

Mr. St‑Roch, would you like to respond?

[Marc St-Roch]

That request has been partially met with the latest changes announced with respect to that incentive, because it now includes farm assets.

However, we'd like businesses to gain access to it more quickly. Instead of it being spread over five years, we'd like it to be quicker.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Thank you, Mr. Ste‑Marie.

MP Davies, go ahead, please.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Ms. Crocker, you started to touch on international students. We know it's estimated that between 70,000 and 130,000 international students holding post-graduation work permits will see their visas expire this year and in 2025. What advice would you give the federal government in this regard?

[Katie Crocker]

It would be to find a pathway for these students to be able to stay.

MP Davies, we talked earlier about pathways for permanence. Seventy thousand students have been living, studying and potentially working part time in Canada at our universities. These are the folks we need to retain.

We don't want the international student program to start being seen as a mechanism for people to make asylum claims. There has to be a way for these students to figure out how they can stay in Canada permanently, if that is an option they would like to exercise. We know that many international students come to Canada because they want to look for pathways to permanent residency.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

You did some great work on this, and in June of this year you released a report entitled, “Working Towards Change: Understanding and Addressing Newcomer Housing Needs”. It provided insights from a year-long study that explored the intersection of housing and settlement for newcomers in B.C.

Can you elaborate on the key findings of the report and what steps the federal government might take to implement your recommendations?