Oh, oh!
Evidence of meeting #80 for Finance in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was green.
A video is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #80 for Finance in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was green.
A video is available from Parliament.
12:55 p.m.
NDP
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
I think there's a certain kind of economic reality that we're faced with, and it behooves us as policy-makers to position Canada well for what's coming, whether we would will it or not.
Earlier, Mr. Lawrence asked for some labour productivity numbers in the green economy. Just to ensure that when we get a response back from Mr. Youngman, who pledged to do that, we're comparing apples with apples, I thought it might be useful to provide some reflections on the nature of that measure.
I'm wondering.... I think we need to have a time slice, right? Labour productivity is measured as a function of GDP. Of course, the price of the good factors into that calculation, so I think there's a question about at what point in time we are looking at fossil-fuel energy workers' productivity. It will depend because we know that the price of oil and gas fluctuates wildly, so I think we need to have a sense of the time horizon over which labour productivity is being compared.
I also think it's important to note that, to the extent that this is a function of GDP, it matters that one industry has been present for many, many decades, is well established, has a lot of access to private capital from within the industry and has been the historical beneficiary of massive amounts of public investment, not just in the 1970s but as recently as three years ago—from what is now over $30 billion coming from this federal government for the oil and gas industry. Those numbers all factor into that evaluation of labour productivity. I would hope that any numbers we get back in respect to productivity for so-called “green workers” control for those important historical and industrial differences.
Then I just want to come back to this question of industrial planning. It seems to me that, for many years—certainly since the early nineties—it has been the established kind of conventional wisdom in Canada—a conventional wisdom that the NDP has been happy to defy and that I, myself, gladly do—that less government involvement in the economy is automatically better. That's what private sector actors want. In fact, we often hear around this table how much the private sector, in this moment of uncertainty and change, wants governments to set a framework for them to be able to make investment decisions. When we talk a lot about investor certainty in the environmental evaluation of certain projects, like pipelines—and we hear from Conservatives that it's important that there be certainty—in fact, that's exactly what industry is asking for with respect to being able to invest in this new emerging economy.
How does Canada begin to deliver after 30 years of pretty much closing our eyes, plugging our ears and pretending that our international competitors didn't have industrial strategies? How does Canada now begin to create the infrastructure we need to be able to catch up to where many of our allies and economic competitors are, whether that's in the European Union or now the United States, which is clearly taking a strategic approach to this emerging, new energy economy?
12:55 p.m.
Team Leader, Green Finance and Investment, Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development
I'll try to provide a quick answer.
The reference to the Inflation Reduction Act in the U.S. is very relevant because the European Union has come up with a sort of proposal to respond to it, and it is triggering international discussions on the role of industrial policy and meeting climate targets. That's an opportunity that Canada may wish to consider for its own policy-making.
1 p.m.
NDP
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
Mr. Usher, do you have anything you'd like to add?
Okay.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
1 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Fonseca
Thank you, MP Blaikie.
I don't know about the shoemaker, MP Blaikie, but I can tell you that we got a lot of mileage out of today's testimony from our two witnesses.
We want to thank Mr. Youngman and Mr. Usher on behalf of our finance committee, studying the current state of play on green finance. We thank you for the many questions you answered here for us today.
Thank you very much.
This meeting is adjourned.