Fisheries Committee on March 11th, 2008

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

I have one more quick question, if I have time.

On the west coast, on the Fraser River, in fact, the issue of removing gravel from some of the extensive gravel bars there becomes somewhat controversial from time to time. Can you tell us what the role of your department is in that whole process?

[Loyola Hearn, Conservative, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Gravel removal is certainly a provincial responsibility—correct me if I'm wrong here, please—but because it may affect fish or fish habitat, we have to play a role and give approvals.

It's been a bit of a pain over the last few years. Usually you get a rush to remove gravel when there is a threat of flood. But you just can't go out with a wheelbarrow and a shovel and remove a bit of gravel. I've seen some maps...and if it's of interest or concern to the committee, you should have somebody provide a map to see how the Fraser, and I presume other rivers, had been filling in with huge amounts of gravel. Just for fish passage alone I think we should be looking at some gravel removal, because you're seeing changing of courses in the river.

In terms of gravel removal, you know, somebody has to do it. Usually it's a contractor. To get to the gravel you quite often have to build access ways, whether it be bridges or whatever. Quite often there is an effect on fish habitat. Sometimes it's near spawning grounds. All of these things have to be factored in.

What we are now doing with the Government of British Columbia is trying to be proactive, trying to move ahead to make decisions—where you can remove it, what needs to be done—and have all these things in place. It seems the overall plan, as we move forward, is that you won't be seeing panic, you'll be seeing an orderly gravel removal to avoid flooding. Diking certainly is much more beneficial when it comes to controlling floods, but gravel can play a part. I think it's also needed just to make sure we have proper flow on the river.

Does anybody want to add anything to that?

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Okay, thank you, Mr. Minister. It's 9:55 now, and I know you were scheduled to be here for one hour. It's now closing in on five minutes.

[Loyola Hearn, Conservative, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

I do have a meeting with a fisheries minister. That's why I'm on a tight schedule.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Okay. We were going to attempt to keep you here a little bit longer, but if your schedule dictates that you can't stay, we understand.

If you want to make a few closing remarks, you're welcome to do so. Then we'll suspend for about five minutes and return after that with the officials.

[Loyola Hearn, Conservative, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank the members for the issues raised and for the ways in which you've raised them. Some of the issues are down-home personal ones, whether it be a war in Mr. Blais' shrimp issue...which is a very important, serious one in Quebec, and we are aware of it.

There are bigger ones, the WTO and the seals. We did announce yesterday the seal quota of 275,000, widely accepted, I think, by both hunters and the industry as being just about right--a significant amount and yet not too much to distort the markets.

On these issues we need everybody involved. These are, as I say, bigger than the department, bigger than any political party.

I would come back to my offer on Bill C-32. It's a piece of legislation that will help us clear up a lot of the concerns. Nobody got a chance to raise the Larocque situation today. Over the years the departments successively could provide funding to different groups to do scientific work in their own areas. It was invaluable when you had the people in the boats working with you on science. The Larocque decision sort of put that to bed. We had to try to find other funding. The act will help us there. It will help us in habitat, it will help us in enforcement, it will help us do a tremendous amount of things.

So I would suggest that, really, if you're serious about helping fishermen--and I know you are--maybe it's time to look at that in the big picture and take the bill to committee. I will arrange to get it here as fast as you want it, and then it's in your hands as to how long you want to keep it.

Other than that, Mr. Chair, I know you have a lot on your schedule, but if there's a gap here and there and we can fit it in, I don't mind at all; I think it's beneficial to all of us to come and have an open and frank discussion. We'll come any time that I'm free and that you want us to come.

I offer again, as I did before, especially to the people around the table who are the ones more directly involved, that if there are specific things—some of you know this already—then just bring them directly to my attention in the House if they're important. I'll see that we deal with them as quickly as we can.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you, Minister.

Just as a closing remark, yesterday we had Ambassador Sullivan before the committee for almost two hours. Certainly, he provided some great information to us on his efforts, especially in Europe, in regard to sealing.

There was a motion put forward by Mr. Stoffer that some members of the committee maybe should travel to Europe later and assist Ambassador Sullivan and his delegation in their efforts, especially with the European Parliament.

He had a lot to say, and once it's all interpreted and we have a copy of what he said, we certainly will be following up the motion to the Liaison Committee to seek assistance for that trip. We certainly would like to have your support on that, if possible.

[Loyola Hearn, Conservative, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

On that, I already mentioned to one of your members yesterday that I had heard about the motion. I support it solidly.

I was in Belgium and met with a number of people about a year ago. It's when you talk to the politicians—forget the anti-protestors and the protestors, and everybody else out on the streets. The people who make the decision, as it is here, are the people who sit around and vote in the House. It doesn't matter what pressure bears on them; they will be the ones to say yes or no.

The ones I talked to, almost unanimously, had a one-sided story: the 20-year-old video of the whitecoat being clubbed. That's what they had heard about, and they thought it was terrible. Those who knew a bit more supported us, including some of our Irish friends who were over there and spoke out in our favour. As long as the hunt is sustainable and humanely conducted, that's all they want. But it takes politicians to talk to politicians. God bless all of our officials dealing with the other officials. It is the politicians talking to other politicians at that level who will make the difference.

I would suggest that if the whole committee could go there and spread out and talk to people, it would be well worthwhile—and I will defend you against anybody who says it's just another foolish junket.

I would also like to thank the committee for supporting me in what we had to do in taking the shrimp quota from P.E.I. I'll make sure it's spread around to everybody.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Loyola Hearn, Conservative, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

We don't have time for any more questions.

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

We'll take a five-minute recess.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

I'll call the meeting back to order.

We're not going to have opening remarks. We're just going to begin with our round here. We have some committee business to take care of, so we're going to do a round first.

Who wants to go first? I don't think Mr. Byrne will be going first any more, after this morning.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Mr. Simms? No?

Mr. Matthews.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

I'll ask something.

I tried to convince you, Mr. Chairman, to get the minister to stay another few minutes, and he was here another few minutes, so we could have asked some more questions.

Just yesterday, while flying here, I noticed in a couple of newspapers some announcements on small craft harbours in Nova Scotia. It's a good thing these are being announced so early, on March 10. The last time the minister was here, I asked when we might get the small craft harbours announcements out, but I didn't anticipate we'd have announcements so early in March. I'm pleased with that.

I just wanted to ask the minister, but will now ask you, when can we expect the small craft harbours funding approval announcements for the Newfoundland and Labrador region, since I read some Nova Scotia announcements yesterday?

[A voice]

They're all approved. They're all done as a batch.

[Michelle d'Auray]

Thank you for the question.

I think as the projects are ready to be rolled out, they are ready to be announced. I don't know if there are any specific elements that Mr. Hegge might want to add to that.

That's basically the way we move forward on these projects.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Well, I really didn't hear an answer.

Every year, as I said to the minister the last time he was here, the announcements are made so late. And then with such short construction seasons, and weather and stuff, we always get a lot of carryovers and work not completed as early as we would like it to be completed. So it seems to me that if there were small craft harbour announcements in Nova Scotia within the last day or so, we'd hear of the others too, as I would think they're all done around the same time. I'd just like an answer as to when I can expect the Newfoundland and Labrador approvals, and when these subsequent announcements will be made.

Having said that, and maybe I'm jumping to the wrong conclusion, I am assuming that the announcements I saw yesterday are part of the most recently approved budget—or maybe the money came from somewhere else.

Maybe someone can clarify that for me. I'm not sure.

[Michelle d'Auray]

The funds for small craft harbours that were in the budget are actually for the enhanced divestiture plans; they're not for the construction or the general program we have for the refit, retrofit, or enhancement of small craft harbours. We also had some funds available for divestiture, but the new funds will not be integrated into our program until later this fiscal year. So we would not be advancing or working with these funds until they are actually integrated into our budget, which they are not at this point.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Yes. I saw the $10 million item in the budget for the divestiture program, but I'm pretty certain that what I saw yesterday was not divestiture. I forget the number of them, but I should have brought the press release with me.

Let me just ask this question, and one of you should be able to answer it. Have the decisions been made for small craft harbours for 2008-09?

[Michelle d'Auray]

I would think that most of the plans at this point would have been finalized. I think there are still a few outstanding issues with regard to the availability of plans, or the completeness of some of the plans, at this point before we can move ahead with some of the construction. In order for us to be ready for the construction seasons—plural—as you indicated, most of the allocations for 2008-09.... A number of them are actually carried over from the previous year, so most of the drafts at this point would be complete.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Yes, go ahead.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Mr. Da Pont, how many coast guard lifeboats are there across the country? Is it 38, 41, 42?

[Commissioner George Da Pont, Commissioner, Canadian Coast Guard, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

I assume the 47-footers are the ones you're referring to.