Fisheries Committee on Nov. 19th, 2007

[Cal Hegge]

I could answer that the small craft harbours program is a separate, distinct program within the department. As the committee may be aware, in the program activity architecture it finds itself lodged within the safe and accessible waterways, along with the Canadian Coast Guard and the Canadian Hydrographic Service. That's how we feature it in our program activity architecture.

The program itself, for a number of reasons, I guess, resides within human resources corporate services. It's not maybe the most logical link, but we think it works reasonably well in there because it is an infrastructure-based program.

I am the ADM responsible for the small craft harbours program, but as you know, I have a lot of other responsibilities. Robert Bergeron, as the current director general, is the most senior departmental official involved in the program.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

And what about in the regions? Who is the highest ranking?

[Cal Hegge]

The regions have what we call RDs of small craft harbours. We're in the process of standardizing those positions at the EX-1, or director level, if you will. As I mentioned earlier, they report in all cases to either the regional director general or, in a couple of cases, to the associate regional director general. But they are very high levels within the government.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

Is it a dedicated task for all the people who work on small craft harbours, or do they work in other areas as well?

[Cal Hegge]

No, they're fully dedicated to the small craft harbours program.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

And what would you say is the level of morale among those people, as opposed to the harbour authorities?

[Cal Hegge]

Well, Robert may want to add to this, but I had the opportunity to attend an all-staff meeting of the small craft harbours directorate a year or so ago, and I would categorize the morale as considerably high. There are a lot of so-called lifers in that program who have been with it for years. They all understand the challenges of the program, but they are a very dedicated group. I am continuously impressed with their level of dedication.

Do you want to add something?

[Robert Bergeron]

I would concur with this, but we do have very dedicated people at small craft harbours. Some have been there for their entire career. I would say that if they are there, it's not because they cannot go elsewhere; it's because they love this program. They are really volunteering for small craft harbours, if you like. On the other hand, it's true to say that the people have been overworked in the last several years. For instance, we got this additional $100 million over five years to deliver on, and we did not increase the human resources in the program to be able to manage this. We managed it with the existing staff we had. We're getting close to a time when we're going to lose a lot of people.

Also, one thing that is worth noticing is that we do have a large number of lifers, but all these people are about to retire. So fairly soon, within the next three to five years, we're going to lose a lot of good people in this program. We're quite cognizant of that. It's very important that we start investing in new HR resources for the program.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

Has there ever been any discussion of it becoming a special operating agency?

[Cal Hegge]

Yes. When we were having discussions around the coast guard becoming a special operating agency, we looked at a couple of other programs within the department. There was some analysis done. It was decided at that time not to proceed with the small craft harbours as a special operating agency, but that's a notion we could revisit at some time in the future.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

Do you personally see some value in that, and what might that be?

[Cal Hegge]

I think, as the coast guard has found, there is some value, if only to raise the profile of the program. Having said that, I think it has a pretty high profile within the existing organizational structure, but that would be one advantage I could see in it becoming a special operating agency.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

Is that the only advantage you see--profile-raising?

[Cal Hegge]

They probably would have the sense of family. And maybe, as you alluded to earlier when you asked the question about whether they are a separate program, I think being a special operating agency, as I've seen it evolve within the coast guard, seems to have contributed to the morale. As to whether it would lead to additional funding, probably not necessarily so, but it would certainly distinguish it even more than it is now. That's why I made reference to the program activity architecture, because it is highlighted there as a separate program.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you, Mr. Kamp, and thank you to our witnesses.

That completes our second round. We're nine minutes overdue, but since this is the first meeting, I was a bit lenient with the time. We'll be improving on that from here on out, I'm sure.

I'd like to thank the witnesses.

We'll have a couple of minutes of break so we can get ready for our next session.

Thank you again.

[Proceedings continue in camera]