Fisheries Committee on April 16th, 2008

[Norman Peters]

You might have. When it first started, I think some jobs were getting done fast just to make it look like, “Hey, the harbour authorities; that's going to be the baby, that's going to save our wharves.” But then it kind of petered out. We're now back to the same thing, back to calling our politicians. There's no change.

I asked my wife the other day what change there's been since harbour authority. I had to go out the other day and take the time to try to find three companies to do a little job, to give them each a tender. It took half a day, and I didn't get a cent for it. There's no money to pay me. Harbours don't have that kind of money. There's no funding put in place to say we're going to put a certain amount of money here so that you can travel, go to other harbours, meet other fishermen, and get together. We do have a national meeting, but....

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Let me just ask a quick question, because I'm sure my time is pretty much up.

You only fish lobsters, is that correct?

[Norman Peters]

That's all we've got.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

How much lobster are you allowed to catch per year?

[Norman Peters]

We're allowed to catch whatever we can catch that's legal: two and three-quarter inches from the eye to the back of the body.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Yes, but I'm thinking about after a certain 10,000 pounds or 20,000 pounds, say. What are you allowed to catch? Is it as much as you can, or is it cut off?

[Norman Peters]

Well, it's within the rules, the DFO rules. You catch what you can catch. It's a very competitive business.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

So it's a competitive fishery. You're not restricted to 5,000 pounds or 10,000 pounds.

[Norman Peters]

No, no.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Okay.

So what size of vessels are we talking about in, let's say, your harbour?

[Norman Peters]

Mine is 43. Some are 45, but the majority are between 43 and 45.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

So you go to the lobster grounds and come back into your port. You're not in a situation that we experience in Newfoundland, where they've become more mobile and have gone to bigger vessels farther offshore. You're not in that situation.

[Norman Peters]

They go after crab or lobster. We don't have any crab. We get a little allocation from the minister, or the P.E.I. Fishermen's Association--

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Basically what I'm asking you, or I guess suggesting, is that just comparing where we were the last few days to today is.... Your berthage space is quite predictable. What we're finding in other harbours is that because they've gone to the larger vessels, the fleets are more mobile. You're pretty much stationary, I guess. You go out and come back to your own harbour. That's the difference, is it?

[Norman Peters]

Yes.

[Bill Matthews, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Okay. Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you, Mr. Matthews.

Mr. Lévesque.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Mr. Peters, I've learned that you made photocopies of your presentation to distribute them to us. It isn't out of bad faith that they weren't distributed. According to the committee's regulations, presentations must be filed in both official languages. I'm sure they'll be distributed to us later. We note most of what you've told us, but we'll make sure to read your presentations because they were very interesting.

I have a lot of questions to ask you. I want to thank you personally for the sympathies you offered to the families of the fishermen involved in the unfortunate accident. I would like my colleague who represents those people to receive them as well.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Thank you very much, Yvon.

Thank you, Mr. Peters. I represent the Gaspé Peninsula and the Magdalen Islands. Your message of sympathy affected me very much. I consider it a message of solidarity with what was experienced and with what we'll experience in the coming weeks and months. In that sense, I thank you very much.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

I'm from the Arctic Coast, James Bay, Hudson Bay and Ungava Bay. We probably don't have the same problems as you.

Do you have a lot of port facilities that are equipped with breakwaters? Could breakwaters greatly extend the life of facilities and structures?

In the health field, it has long been said that prevention is less costly than cure. The same is true of coastal, road and other infrastructures. It has to be maintained, just like we maintain our houses. In that sense, I wonder whether breakwaters constitute preventive maintenance.

How much does dredging cost you a year? How many small craft harbours does your authority have?

You mustn't pay a lot of tax, in view of your operating costs. Perhaps you should ensure that you earn enough money to pay tax, at some point.

On that point, I turn the floor over to you.

[Norman Peters]

I think I got the question. I'm not used to these little fangled rigs you have here.

Actually breakwaters are the main breakwater that struts out into the sea. That's what saves our harbour right now. If that wasn't there a lot of homes would be gone. There are homes built along there. A breakwater is to break the water, and that's not in too bad shape, but it's our inner wharves where we tie the boats, inside the harbours, that we're having the problem with.

I'll give you a little example. There was another job done two weeks ago. We went around and we got three people to commit on it and one to tender. He pulled it up and did some work, but he noticed there was no back wall, so the clay would keep coming.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

How much money do you spend on dredging, and how often are you required to do it?

[Norman Peters]

Our last harbour was dredged in 1989. That's a long time ago.

Right now when we're going out of Rustico we skirt along the breakwater. You can't go too close there, and then you have to turn.

I made numerous attempts in Charlottetown to get it dredged, and all they tell me is that I have a very safe, navigable harbour. I told them we were going to run into the breakwater. They said you have a stream going through there, and that's all you need.

Listen, I said, there are seven or eight boats taking tourists out of our harbour. It's a little viable business. I do it. There's going to be a bad accident there some day, and what's going to happen? We're going to lose some people on account of no dredging.

But again I must say, it's not only our harbour. All harbours on the north side are sandy harbours, some worse than others. Ours was man-made; it was our mistake. But I won't go into that; that's a whole different kettle of fish, I know.

Lawrence is pointing at his watch. When I get into the House of Commons you'll not do that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

There you go. Mr. MacAulay is worried now.

Mr. Stoffer, you have five minutes, please.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Peters, it's good to see you again, and happy birthday.

I've heard this in private but never at a public meeting before, the fact that if you didn't form a harbour authority or harbour association then you wouldn't get any funding for that harbour. Is that correct?