Fisheries Committee on April 18th, 2008

[Anita Collin]

In our area, most of the loster fishermen are between 30 and 50 years of age. Some of them fish with their sons. The sons will take over the business. I know that the fishers would like to see the young people return to their homes and take over, but the young people are seeing what is going on and ask themselves what the future hold for them in Gaspésie if the government does not do anything.

In our area, the people who work in both of our factories are not old. The workers are young. However, our dock is in ruin. Lobster fishermen and other fishermen are fishing off the coast line of neighbouring towns. They are unloading elsewhere. At the rate things are going, both of our factories will shutdown. What will remain then of these two small towns? The factories are providing the people jobs. It is all that we have in our small town. One of our factories is among the oldest in Eastern Canada. We would like to preserve it.

I can understand young people. For now, there are newcomers, but were they remain? We work hard to bring our young people back. I, myself, I am a mother of two children who live outside of town. They see that there is no future here now. But what little we do have, we want to keep.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

How old are your children?

[Anita Collin]

They are 30 and 28 years of age.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Please continue.

[Anita Collin]

Many fishers have children who fish with them now, and those children are between 25 and 35 years of age. Some fishers who are 50 years old are planning to retire in a few years and they think that they will be replaced. This has been going for generations. I can tell you that some permits have been transferred down three or four generations. The permits are handed down from father to son. However, all this is going to come to an end as some point?

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Thank you. I now would like to talk about aquaculture.

You said that aquaculture will eclipse traditional fishing.

[Stéphane Morissette]

Those are the predictions of the Food and Agriculture Organization, the FAO. On the global scale, aquaculture, to a certain extent, is compensating for the depletion of fish stocks. This is not a matter of competition, but simply that there is a market for seafood, but almost everywhere the fisheries are in decline. Aquaculture therefore is a solution.

We believe that aquaculture is going to develop and Quebec must be part and parcel of its growth. In Quebec, marine aquaculture has been developing only in the last fifteen years. Of course, this industry can only develop in small craft harbours. In fact, aquaculture could develop in and around dock areas. Without harbour infrastructure, this will be very difficult.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank, Mr. Simms.

Mr. Blais.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Bravo Scott, your effort is much appreciated and you did quite well, really.

I will try my turn at un moment donné, moi aussi.

Anita, for the benefit of the committee members, I would like you to tell us about what you and your community experienced a few months ago? Can you explain to me how things unfolded?

[Anita Collin]

I work as a counsellor with the people in these small towns. One Sunday, I received a call to attend an assembly of fishermen at the Saint-Georges community centre to be held the next day. I arrived, and it was during this meeting that officials from Fisheries and Oceans advised us that the dock would be closed and that access would be completely prohibited. This was a few days before the start of the fishing season.

Therefore, what do you think we did to address the situation? We stated that informing us of the closure with only a few days advance notice made no sense. Our fishermen began to panic. I thought to myself that this made no sense. I then called Mr. Blais, whom I wish to thank for his assistance. I then called Mr. Huet, in Gaspé. He said that he could do nothing. I told him that there were 19 fishermen and 50 jobs at stake , and that it was Friday. He said that there was no solution for us. The Department of Fisheries and Oceans told him that there was no solution. I asked him if he wanted to make a laughing stock of us.

Mr. Mamelonet, the Mayor of the town of Percé, told me not to panic. He told me that he would find a solution, and that he would help me. We went to see the harbour authorities of Percé and of L'Anse-à-Beaufils, who lent us floating docks—let's just say that they were somewhat still afloat—to get us out of a jam.

How do you think our fishers released their cages in the water? There were 19 of them on the dock and each one had approximately 200 cages. Who would be the first? Who would be the last? It is a very difficult situation to be in.

My husband suggested that I open an office at home rather than at the shop. People from everywhere were calling me asking what I was doing for them, which solution I had found and when everything would be set up. At one point, the fishermen were saying that they were going to open the dock. One of them used his loader to remove the cement pillars. He said that if no solution was put forward, he would find one. I told him that he did not have the right to do that. He said that he was assuming the right, because he had to earn a living, and that no one would prevent him from doing that. To my mind, this year, the situation is going to be worse because the dock, with one single motor, will tilt on the bias.

I've brought pictures that I would like you to look at. You will see that this winter, the protective wall of the dock is used as a barrier against snow storms. Mr. Blais knows that I have circulated a petition that has been tabled in the House of Commons. We intend to introduce other petitions, if the government does not help. But this time, it will be serious.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Thank you very much.

What we have to remember is that when the whole community is not only concerned, but involved, results can be produced. Nonetheless, we find ourselves in situations where we are just patching things up. It should not be that way, because as we are doing so, development projects are not moving forward. If we invest all of our energy into that patching up, it becomes exhausting, difficult and frustrating. In addition, some even give up. There are other development projects that we could work on. Right now, we're spending too much time on projects such as those. On the other hand, we can't do anything else. Ms. Collin's message is that in spite of the announcement of a tragedy with only a few days notice, she did not give up.

[Anita Collin]

Nor do I intend to.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Hear! Hear!

[Anita Collin]

I would just like to add something. We had divers go down to look at the wharf from below. I can tell you that they came out of there as fast as they went in. The metal beams are eaten away and broken. There is nothing left. The only thing still in place is the cement slab on the surface. If you are a lobster fisher, you should go and fish there, there are lobster under the wharf.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Stéphane, you have a few seconds to explain how people manage in spite of everything. We manage to get around things, particularly in Gaspé and in Carleton. How do we manage to have a landing place?

[Stéphane Morissette]

At a meeting held recently in Gaspé, the Transport Canada representatives told us clearly that they tolerated us on their wharves. So we are making our presence felt. We have no choice. There is an emerging industry at stake.

The aquaculture industry in Quebec is still in its initial stages, and all of these companies are still quite fragile. And they are paying these costs directly. The business environment that should be in place to promote development is simply not there. The harbour infrastructure is also useful for community development. For example, our boats are equipped with a crane so that they can unload their catches. The equipment on our boats must include this, because there is no crane on the wharf. That is just one example. These costs must be covered by the companies. In my opinion, this is really inadequate.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you.

Mr. Stoffer.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Stéphane, a lot of the aquaculture industry, as you know, is provincially regulated as well. Is the province offering you any assistance in this regard, in terms of accessing wharves and stuff like that? Or have you made an application to the province at all?

[Stéphane Morissette]

This is a political issue. We are talking about federal infrastructure. So there is no provincial investment. The province provides its assistance for many other things, but the harbour infrastructure comes under the responsibility of the federal government. So there is no support from the province for wharves.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

We also heard before--and I don't mean any offence by this--that a fair number of the people to whom we speak in other regions of Atlantic Canada are getting a little older now. It doesn't appear that many young people are coming in behind them.

If you, because of frustration, just said “That's it, we're leaving, we don't want to deal with this any more, you look after it”, what do you think would happen to the costs of that if the federal government had to do all the work that you're doing now?

[Stéphane Morissette]

Well—

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

That's for anybody.

[Carmelle Mathurin]

What would happen if everyone were to resign tomorrow morning? Is that what you mean? What would happen if the volunteers who look after the fishing harbours were to resign?

This would certainly be far from ideal. The entire community would feel the impact. Even if the wharf in a small town is not necessarily adequate for the fishers, it is part of the town. It is part of the people's heritage.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

I'll give you the purpose of my question. The transferring of management responsibilities over to community groups and harbour authorities such as yours was to allow you to charge berthing fees, unloading fees, transit fees, or whatever fees so that you could do the minor maintenance--electrical, water, that kind of stuff. Anything on a bigger scale--structural change--was to be handled and paid for by the federal government. That's sort of the deal that we had understood took place. But we're now understanding, or at least we're hearing, that DFO is not holding up their end of the bargain.

I'm just wondering, sir, if you can ascertain for me how long you think you can keep going before it reaches a critical mass.

[Jacques Dufresne]

I think the situation is extremely difficult for the harbour authorities of small wharves. I think that they are almost at that point.

A few moments ago you asked what the government is doing. There is a harbour master from Transport Canada who manages the harbour. Fisheries and Oceans Canada could do the same thing, it would be no more difficult. They would have to pay the person's salary, and he or she would work full-time, as used to be the case.

You are quite right. Many promises were made at the beginning regarding the program, that were not kept. Even Public Works and Government Services Canada was sidelined. Managers arrived to manage things, and we were taught how to clean oil furnaces and how to be careful not to pollute. We were given training courses.

I do not think this makes any sense, because volunteers, particularly those on a board of directors, should be providing advice, assistance and encouragement, not cleaning garbage cans.

However, as I was saying earlier, a full-time harbour master could do the job. All it would cost would be one salary. Actually, it would only cost half a salary, because the person would only work for half a season.

To support Stéphane, I would like to come back to the subject of marine aquaculture for a moment. We said that there will be more and more of this. For our part, we are quite lucky: aquaculture will become increasingly important in the Baie des Chaleurs and in the Gaspé Bay, because there are almost no groundfish left. In Quebec, these two bays are very fortunate because they are very well sheltered. There is no doubt that this activity will grow tremendously.

Our relations with Transport Canada are not that difficult. When these people come here, they explain their doctrine, and that is it. I think that politically, someone at a higher level than these people should simply have to push a button. The problem would be solved. With the exception of the spur wharf that Stéphane mentioned, the main wharves are in very good condition. As we have been told, the red flag must be there to serve everyone, not just one user, and someone with good political connections needs to tell the officials that sharing and accommodation are the right approach. In Gaspé at the moment we are being threatened with talk that some industries will certainly be coming to town. For these people, two birds in the bush are worth more than one bird in the hand.

I'm 54 years old and I can say that in Gaspé, we have been told five or six times that there would be incredible development, and that there would not be enough room left to build houses. As Stéphane said, we are suffering because of that at the moment. It would be more profitable for us, rather than having to listen to these people who come and explain their theories, to have someone try to work with us to find some solutions. I think we would find solutions, and I do not think it would be all that difficult. At the moment, the turf wars between Fisheries and Oceans Canada and Transport Canada are almost the only thing that is happening. It is as simple as that.