Fisheries Committee on Feb. 10th, 2009

[George Da Pont, Commissioner, Canadian Coast Guard, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

Thank you very much, Minister.

The estimates and the profile of the funding are attributable to the planned major capital expenditures for the acquisition of the midshore patrol vessels. We had envisioned, as reflected in the estimates, acquiring the vessels and spending the money in the next two or three years. So the drop-off that you see was the planned end of acquiring all of the midshore patrol vessels. That's essentially the difference. It's not a drop-off in operating funding.

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

The Pacific Salmon Treaty, of course, will be tabled in the House, so it will be available for discussion.

On PNCIMA, the department will ensure that the financing will be in place to host that event.

We haven't had sufficient time yet to go through the Supreme Court decision on aquaculture, but we do realize the ramifications that it may have for us.

The Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation study is complete, and it is available. So we will make that available for you.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you.

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

We'll have someone send you a copy.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Mr. Stoffer, you're a star this morning. You have 30 seconds left.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

I could cram a lot in 30 seconds.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

We'll move now to Mr. Calkins.

I believe you're splitting your time with Mr. Weston.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

That's correct, Mr. Chair.

I certainly want to pass on my congratulations as well, Minister. As a caucus colleague, I certainly wish you all the best in your role, and long may you serve as our Minister of Fisheries and Oceans in a Conservative government.

Furthermore, I'd also like to extend my best wishes to Michelle and also best wishes to Claire on recent developments in your careers. I want to thank you for what you do on behalf of fishermen across our great country.

Minister, I'm going to ask you some questions in regards to the Freshwater Fish Marketing Act and the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation. Before being accompanied by Dave Van Kesteren, I used to be the only member of this committee who actually represented a riding that was inside the jurisdiction of the Freshwater Fish Marketing Act, and I believe I still am. I don't think Dave's actually in the area, although he does represent an Ontario riding.

In the last session of Parliament we talked extensively about small craft harbours, and part of our study took us to Gimli, Manitoba. We spoke with fishermen there. I took that opportunity to ask questions not only about small craft harbours but also about what the effect is of the Freshwater Fish Marketing Act. Furthermore, in the last session of Parliament we did instruct the George Morris Centre and had a report commissioned where we had some feedback, and if you take a look at the media that's happened since then, it came to light to the committee that there were lots of opportunities. I think the jury is out on whether the Freshwater Fish Marketing Act is good or bad. I think there are some positive things there and I think there are some places where some improvements could be made.

In light of the fact that the testimony we heard resulted in fishermen actually bushing fish or throwing fish away, in light of the fact that we have media releases coming from Transcona or from the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation that we've shut down the delivery of walleye or something like that simply because of increased stocks.... We have orderly marketing of fish, but fishermen don't have orderly catching of fish, which is one of the issues.

So I guess my question to you, Minister, is this. What are your plans or what objectives do you have in light of the fact of that report that came in? Some of the recommendations that are in that report and some of the testimony we've heard here at this committee would certainly lead us to believe that there could be some improvements made, and I'm just wondering what your plans and priorities are for the next little while in regard to the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation and that act.

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

Thank you very much.

I will say that my experience since I've been at DFO is that there are people on both sides of this issue, whether it's good or bad, and I'm going to ask my deputy to answer that question, if you don't mind. Michelle is much more up to speed on freshwater fish marketing than I would be.

[Michelle d'Auray, Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

Thank you, Minister.

I think the study revealed that changing the single desk, because of the market and the way it was constructed, was probably not the most optimal way, but it did allow the FFMC and pointed out that a number of pilot projects could be tried with different organizations. And we have been working with the organization to see if there are some pilots that could be undertaken, so that we can test some of the different market options.

The other thing, too, is that we have and will shortly engage the provinces, because they're the ones that actually have the seats on the board. If they don't initiate the discussions and the changes.... We're not the ones who direct the structure of the organization. It really is up to the standing members of the board, which is made up of the provincial and territorial representatives. We will engage in more formal discussions with them and the FFMC to get a better sense.... We hear anecdotally, but we would really want to get a sense from the provincial representatives and territorial representatives, and the harvesters as well who also sit on the board, where the direction should be at this point.

So we've had a variety of views, but we haven't had a formal process, if I can put it that way. We've had reports, we've had the FFMC strategic plan; the next step for us is to work with the FFMC, with the jurisdictions and the harvesters who are on the board.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Do you have a timeline for that?

[Michelle d'Auray]

It will be throughout the course of the year, depending on the availability of our provincial counterparts.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Have any of the provinces provided any impetus into speeding up this process, and if so, which ones are they?

[Michelle d'Auray]

Specifically, I think there are a couple of provinces and territories who have written to the minister, always I think with the view of encouraging us to engage. I think it's opportune now to actually get all of them together rather than separately.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Mr. Weston.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I congratulate our new minister and I thank her for coming to visit our committee today.

Madam Minister, you mentioned in your opening remarks your commitment to bolster the aquaculture sector. In my west coast riding there are many ports and many fishermen and fisherwomen, and there are also many fish. We have several aquaculture farms that are a growing source of controversy. Maclean's magazine reported on this last week, and there was yesterday's decision of the B.C. Supreme Court, which gives the governments a year to respond to the decision that the province doesn't have at least sole jurisdiction over aquaculture.

Advocates believe that fish farms create a viable source of food and that it's a lucrative industry for investors, employment is created, and government officials appreciate the tax revenue. At the same time, critics claim that natural fish stocks are decreasing in proportion to the increase in farmed fish.

Madam Minister, I have four related questions.

First--and you've already answered this to some degree--in light of yesterday's decision, what do you see as the federal government's jurisdiction in aquaculture?

Second, do you have any legislation in mind that would affect fish farming?

Third, what plans do you have to investigate the relationship between aquaculture and natural fish stocks?

Fourth, I understand you were in British Columbia in the last few months. I wonder if you can tell us something about the findings from your trip as those findings relate to aquaculture.

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

Thank you very much.

I will say that on my trip to B.C. I found out that salmon is king, and very important. There is, as you said, the division between those who promote aquaculture and those who don't. I would have to say that I think we have to find a balance, because the aquaculture industry has grown tremendously over the last number of years and it's an important source of food for the world.

I think we can find a balance. Our department is putting significant resources into science around aquaculture versus the wild fishery and whether or not one affects the other. I will be honest, I haven't read the court decision yet. But there was also another report that came out, I believe last week, from B.C. to do with aquaculture. I do believe there are lots of opportunities in aquaculture, and we're going to do whatever we can to ensure that they can survive and grow side by side with the wild fishery. We are investing resources in research around this issue to try to get the facts of what is actually happening.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Madam Minister, is there a timeline in terms of what's happening? Are there any specific developments that you foresee over the year to come?

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

I guess I can say yes. We probably didn't expect this development that happened yesterday. Things are changing all the time, so I wouldn't want to put a timeline on it, but I do want to make it quite clear that we do support aquaculture development and support it in a sustainable manner.

I don't know if any of my colleagues would like to jump in and add anything to that.

[Michelle d'Auray]

If I may, Minister, there is an increased interest, obviously, in making sure there are good baseline data. We have a very extensive program, as the minister said, in terms of aquaculture research and looking at the impact of aquaculture on wild stocks.

For this particular year we will also be doing a very extensive baseline study. Some of the harvesters are going to put certain parts of the system in fallow, so we will be able to track the wild stock going through. We will have a baseline of what is, in fact, the state of the stock without an impact from aquaculture in particular areas. So then we'll be able, when the fallow period ends and the fish pens become active again, to measure the difference between one year without and one year with. I think that will be a very important study from the perspective of being able to tell what the balance is.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much, Minister.

Do you have any closing comments you'd like to make? We appreciate your coming here this morning and taking the time to meet with your committee. I will leave the final comments to you.

[Gail Shea, Conservative, Egmont, PE]

First of all, thank you again for inviting me here today.

I was very sincere in saying that I appreciate any suggestions that you have to improve the fishery. We do realize we're probably going into a bit of a more difficult time than we have had in the past. There are a lot of difficult decisions to be made, not just with possibly some suffering markets coming up in the next year but also with declining stocks.

I will say that three principles that are very important to me are economic viability, sustainability, and consultation. That is how we will try to operate the Department of Fisheries and Oceans.

Again, thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you, Minister.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear!