Evidence of meeting #46 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amundsen.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
As the commissioner of the Canadian Coast Guard, I am very comfortable with this situation. Whether the money for this environmental research comes from oil companies, universities or other research groups, the Canadian Coast Guard operates the vessel for scientific purposes. So I am very comfortable with that.
If the committee feels that we are in a blatant conflict of interest, please let me know. Personally, I think it is merely a perceived conflict of interest.
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
Mr. Grégoire, that is not what I said, and that is not what the committee thinks either. I agree with you, there is no blatant conflict of interest—none, we are agreed on that. However, what I wonder about is the appearance of a conflict of interest. Are you comfortable with the appearance of a conflict of interest?
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
You seem to be saying that there is a perceived conflict of interest. I could ask you what makes you think so.
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
Do you feel comfortable, Mr. Grégoire, with the appearance of a conflict of interest?
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
I am comfortable with the history of the Amundsen and the manner in which it operates. I am comfortable with the coast guard's role in that mission in support of the scientific community.
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
Are you equally comfortable with the fact that your involvement is helping the oil industry?
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
I don't know whether it is helping. Oil representatives appeared before you. It is not for me to decide whether the oil companies—
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
And so you lease your vessel to ArcticNet, and then it is out of your hands? You do not monitor what goes on? I would think you do.
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
We make sure that the scientific missions are feasible from an operational standpoint.
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
You are concerned strictly with that aspect, but not the interests of the mission or anything of that nature. No big deal, as long as the money comes in.
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
That is not quite how we see it. Those are your words.
I am comfortable with the situation, Mr. Blais. I do not know how else to explain it. I, the commissioner, the Canadian Coast Guard and the Department of Fisheries and Oceans are all comfortable with the situation. We have no direct relationship with the oil companies. They do research—
Bloc
Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC
There is no relationship, I grant you that, Mr. Grégoire.
Conservative
NDP
Fin Donnelly NDP New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
My thanks to both our guests for appearing in front of the committee.
At a previous fisheries and oceans committee meeting, we heard from representatives of the ArcticNet program as well as oil company representatives. One of the questions I asked those representatives was whether they saw the irony in a Canadian research vessel studying the effects of climate change in the Arctic with these oil companies partially financing this program.
I'm wondering if I could ask you the same question, along the lines of the discussion that was just happening. Do you agree that the Canadian public may think it ironic that a Canadian vessel financed by an oil company is being used to study climate change?
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
As I said, this has been known since the very beginning. The fact that the network of researchers could seek funding from those kinds of companies or other sources has been known since 2002, and has been known therefore for the last eight or nine years. Is that an irony? I don't know.
Would it be better if it were a foreign vessel from China or another country? I think the Amundsen is the flagship of the coast guard. It's a ship that is extremely well equipped with top-notch scientific equipment. If some of the funds come from petroleum companies, so be it.
I do not have a problem with that, because the research that is being done is in the public domain. Everything they do is put in the hands of the public. There is no proprietary information data collected by these people when they are on board our vessel. They are like any other scientists on board the vessel. I think you did obtain that assurance from Louis Fortier two weeks ago.
NDP
Fin Donnelly NDP New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC
So you've said that you don't know if you see the irony and that you're comfortable with oil companies providing the funds for climate change research.
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
I don't see a conflict of interest situation.
NDP
Fin Donnelly NDP New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC
No, and that was not my question. My question was about whether...and this is the question that I asked: even Mr. Fortier agreed that, yes, there could be a perception by the public that this could be the--
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
By some people in the public, perhaps--
Fin Donnelly NDP New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC
Yes. So that was first question: it was to establish if you actually think that this is at all ironic. If you don't, then I really can't go any further, because after that I wanted to ask you, if you do feel there is some irony here, are you comfortable with that? It does sound as though you're saying that you don't see the irony and you're comfortable with that.
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
I am comfortable with the situation as long as the coast guard is not involved in selecting who pays, where the money comes from. We're not part of those discussions. We're only part of the discussion when we're asked if the mission that is proposed by scientists is operationally feasible.
NDP
Fin Donnelly NDP New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC
Okay.
I only have a short amount of time, so I will ask my second question. You mentioned that coast guard resources are being used in this vessel. Do you feel this is the best use of coast guard resources when in fact, for instance, the issue of oil spill response has been brought up and criticized by the commissioner? Is this something that--
Commissioner, Fisheries and Oceans Canada, Canadian Coast Guard
The coast guard is not using any resources in this mission. When the ship sails for science, it is paid for 100% by Université Laval.
