Fisheries Committee on March 29th, 2010

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC]

Thank you.

As has been previously mentioned, aquaculture has been raised as a definite hot topic and possible link to the disappearance of all or some of this run last year.

I'm also curious that if, for instance, at the end of the study there's a link to aquaculture, and habitat loss, and pollution, but let's say perhaps also to ocean conditions, do you anticipate a recommendation that would say we need to put resources into scientific research in terms of determining what happens to salmon when they migrate into the ocean?

[Brian Wallace]

I can't anticipate, obviously, what recommendations will be made. But you suggest some that might be possible if it's simply an area in which there isn't enough information, perhaps.

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC]

Finally, you mentioned this will be fairly specific to Fraser River sockeye, and I just want to clarify, would evidence on other river basins, either in the province or in other jurisdictions, be considered? And will other runs of salmon be looked at?

[Brian Wallace]

Again--

[Fin Donnelly, NDP, New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC]

Sorry, types, runs and types of salmon species.

[Brian Wallace]

If it's relevant to Fraser River sockeye and perhaps it may be in terms of comparison, why did something happen there and not here, I could see it, but I haven't heard that suggested yet. There are other sockeye runs on other rivers, for example, that have had different results. So that might engage a comparison. I can't anticipate.

I think we have to be careful that this doesn't take on a mandate creep or something where it gets too far away.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you.

Mr. Weston.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Mr. Wallace and Ms. Tessaro, in case there's any possible sense that there's any doubt about our confidence in the legal profession, may I just quote Neil Young and say “long may you run”.

We've talked about the mandate here and Mr. Donnelly was referring to past inquiries and commissions. He said something about do we have any reason to believe that under Minister Shea things will be different from previous ministers. As someone who called for an inquiry based on what people in my riding wanted, and there were several round tables in my riding and people came to the conclusion we needed an inquiry, I had the honour to ask the Prime Minister in the House of Commons what was he going to do, and he responded with the announcement of this very commission.

I'm intrigued by your sense of this power to subpoena. Is it not true that the power of subpoena means that you'll be able to bring department officials before you who may say things that are embarrassing to the department or not? Is it not a courageous thing to arm the inquiry with such sweeping powers of subpoena, and doesn't it enable you to do things that might not have been anticipated otherwise?

[Brian Wallace]

I'm not sure it's up to me to comment on how the terms of reference were established, Mr. Weston. We work with the tools we have, and that's one of them.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Is it not a strong one in terms of getting at the truth?

[Brian Wallace]

The commissioner only gets to make recommendations. At the end of the day, the result will be whether or not anything happens with those recommendations.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you.

Mr. Allen.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

I have two quick questions.

From a different tack, assuming this committee went into this in a little more depth and looked at aquaculture or something of that nature, presumably we would end up potentially calling some of those witnesses who are part of your standing list, if you will, and maybe some of the individuals. First, do you see that as potentially confusing to those who may testify to two perceived government inquiries that are going on?

Second, if we choose to go ahead and do that anyway, and we hear evidence, I'm assuming the commission would put a process in place whereby it would pick up the information from the publicly available testimony and incorporate that into its findings. Is that true?

[Brian Wallace]

Mr. Allen, I don't think I can comment on how others might perceive those two things going on at the same time.

In terms of use of evidence, there may be some restrictions on our ability to use evidence given before a parliamentary committee. I haven't looked into that. As a practical matter, we're trying to get whatever evidence we can before the commission, as long as it's put before it in a way that is fair to everybody.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay, thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Mr. Kamp.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

Primarily I want to thank you for the work you're doing. I know it's going to be a challenging task.

I acknowledge that I tend to be a “glass half empty” kind of a guy, but at the end of the day it's possible you will come to the conclusion that either you don't know what's causing the decline--and I guess that is a logical possibility--or you'll find that it's something we can't control. Those are possibilities. We hope not. As one who lives there, we hope you come up with some strong recommendations that will revolutionize our sockeye salmon fishery on the Fraser. But I guess those other things are possibilities too.

[Brian Wallace]

I don't think that was a question.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

It was a comment.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Wallace and Ms. Tessaro, on behalf of the committee, I'd like to thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedules to provide us with some insight into the commission and how you intend to proceed. You may hear more from us in the future. It is an interesting process, and we certainly wish you all the best.

Thank you very much.

[Brian Wallace]

Thank you very much for the invitation.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you.

We'll take a five-minute break, and then we'll return to discuss Mr. Donnelly's motion.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

We'll bring this meeting back to order.

We'll now convene to consider the motion brought forward by Mr. Donnelly at our previous meeting:

That, in response to information presented to the committee by Trevor Swerdfager, Director General for Fisheries and Aquaculture Management at the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, the committee ask Alexandra Morton to appear before it at the next most convenient possible occasion in order to speak on the issue of sea lice and their impact on the salmon stocks as well as to respond to the testimony given by representatives from the Department of Fisheries and Oceans.

That motion was brought forward on March 22, 2010.

Are there any questions or comments on the motion?

Go ahead, Mr. Kamp.

[Randy Kamp, Conservative, Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission, BC]

My only comment--and I may have an amendment as well--is to ask if we are going to do the eco-certification study, or are we transitioning into something else? That would be my only fear.

We decided we were going to go ahead with that and we heard some good testimony, mostly to get up to speed on the regulation-making process. Some other issues were raised with Trevor. I haven't heard the motion defended yet by Mr. Donnelly, other than what I see here, but I'm guessing that what happened was that Alexandra Morton heard the testimony and asked, through Mr. Donnelly, to appear before us. I'm guessing she plans to correct the record on something she heard; otherwise, I'm not sure what the point of this is. You can correct me if I'm putting words in your mouth, Fin.

Before I perhaps move an amendment to it, could I get some clarification on the point of this motion?

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Go ahead, Mr. Donnelly.