That's a very good point.
I have a final question to both presenters, and I would appreciate your opinion. There's a clash between commercial fishing, with the economies of commercial fisheries, and the protection of fish habitat. We hear presenters from the fishing community and the communities they represent. Could you both comment on that briefly? Do you see that within marine protected areas the two can operate and achieve the same objective, that commercial fishers can earn a livelihood and support the communities they're from, as well as protecting the long-term sustainability of the fisheries in those areas? Or is it simply no?