Fisheries Committee on April 12th, 2016

[Jody Thomas]

Yes.

[Mark Strahl, Conservative, Chilliwack—Hope, BC]

The next question is on timing.

We've heard from Unifor that the workers just aren't there, and that as much as you might want to consolidate as of May 10, there simply aren't enough employees ready to work in those new stations, or it's going to result in massive amounts of overtime to make up for the shortfall in staff at this point.

Is that an accurate statement? If so, when do you think you will be able to move away from perhaps an overtime model to a normalized operation?

[Jody Thomas]

At its core, one of the reasons for consolidation was to look at the amount of overtime. We had individual stations across the country where there were one or two stands. It was difficult always to stop them during silent hours or off-peak hours, and we ended up having people work an excessive amount of overtime. We knew there would be overtime through the consolidation, but we expect it to normalize within six to eight months after we have standardized the system across the country and finished with the consolidation of Comox.

On staffing, vacancies, and moving people around, that's part of management, and we do that all the time, whether it's our MCTS stations, our shore staff, the people who go out and fix the aids to navigation, or even the people who go to sea on our major ships and our fleet. Rotating staff and ensuring that we fill in vacancies is what we do.

There is a robust plan to staff, as Superintendent Bain has told you. We have a national staffing strategy. We also have local targeted ones to ensure that we have people who want to stay and work in a community.

We also have the opportunity for people to apply for jobs and move around. There's value in that, because they see different parts of the system and different parts of the country, and they bring different elements and knowledge to a station. The more people we can cross-train, I think, the more robust a system we have, and a richer system, in fact.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Robert Sopuck]

Our time is up.

Mr. Morrissey, for five minutes.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

The comment was made that the decision to consolidate could be compromising safety as well as increasing employee burnout.

Could you comment on that?

[Jody Thomas]

As I've said, I don't think it's compromising safety. Comox is the last station we need to consolidate, and there has been no indication that safety has been compromised anywhere in this country. As I've said, we are a maritime nation. The flow of vessels in and out of this country is a daily, hourly, minute-to-minute occurrence. No, I don't believe that safety has been compromised.

With employee burnout, I'm very concerned about the health of our employees. We require an enormous amount of resilience of Coast Guard employees. They are dealing with difficult things all the time. It's something we watch carefully. Superintendent Bain knows his employees in his region. He watches them, and works with his officers in charge of the station to watch for that. That's an essential element of good management.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

You're confident these decisions are not leading to stress or burnout within your ranks at these stations?

[Jody Thomas]

I think there is stress and burnout. There was previous to consolidation, because it is a high-demand job. People do occasionally need a break from it. They will going forward as well. It's something we accommodate. The provisions of a public service employee allow for that, and people do have to go on sick leave every now and then.

If they find they can't come back to this kind of work, we find other work for them through an accommodation process. We do pay attention to our employees. Their physical health and their mental health matter to us.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

My question is blunt, but it's not meant to be that.

Would you defend a decision at any cost?

[Jody Thomas]

No, I would not. I have looked very hard at this. I've had discussions with my management team. My assistant commissioners, my deputy commissioners, the directors, and the superintendents know I am engaged in what's going on in the Coast Guard, down to the person.

Mr. Hughes knows that. I work with him on complex labour relation cases down to the person in the organization. No, I would not, but this is a reasonable decision.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Could you define a “reasonable decision” a bit more?

[Jody Thomas]

It's a reasonable decision in that it doesn't compromise safety. We have implemented a new system that allows for a reduction in the number of locations from which we offer the service. It hasn't compromised safety. It has reduced the workload for the employees at the station through the continuous marine broadcasts. They are getting used to the new tools. They are starting to like them across the country. This is the feedback I'm getting.

It is a system that allows us to continuously modernize, innovate, and keep up with other countries in terms of the robustness and the tools within our system. I think that's important.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Could you briefly compare the system we are moving toward to that of other countries?

[Jody Thomas]

I'm not the technical expert, but the Frequentis system is used in many other countries. We've been to their plant in Vienna, and we've seen the countries they are doing the system for. We can get you a listing of who they are.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

This is not unique to Canada?

[Jody Thomas]

It is not. Our old system was outdated. It was falling apart. It was failing, both the hardware and the software, the hardware in particular. We had technology going back to the 1970s, and it was inconsistent across the country, so that it made it difficult to maintain.

You had technologists who were working on something that was bought 10 years ago one day and something that was bought 30 years ago the next day. That doesn't make for a system we can easily maintain and ensure the consistency of and the reliability of. With this new system we can.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

In your assessment, as we move down the road and this consolidation if it is deemed to proceed and is completed, will the service that the Canadian Coast Guard provides be an on par service, or an enhanced service?

[Jody Thomas]

The service provided by the MCTS officers, pre-consolidation and post-consolidation, is world leading. We train them to an extremely high level at the Coast Guard College, and then they go through a rigorous checkout process in each individual station. We have given them now better tools, but the individual MCTS officers were always world leading.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Could you define a bit? I find that intriguing, world leading.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Robert Sopuck]

You have 10 seconds.

[Jody Thomas]

They respond to vessel traffic. We have combined vessel traffic and safety into consolidated stations. I was visiting Finland, and they have now done the same thing. They have seen that as a model to follow.

Our advancements and ways of making this—

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Finland is following us?

[Jody Thomas]

They have done the same thing in their MCTS stations, combined vessel traffic with safety.

We have a vast country, a vast coastline. We've looked at ways to make this work constantly—since the beginning of the Coast Guard.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Robert Sopuck]

Thank you very much.

I'd like to return to the issue that Mr. Strahl raised regarding the use of a recording.

The clerk has pointed out to me rule 299, also found in O'Brien and Bosc:

There are no specific rules governing the nature of questions which may be put to witnesses appearing before committees, beyond the general requirement of relevance to the issue before the committee. Witnesses must answer all questions which the committee puts to them.

Again, these are rules that I'm not aware of, but you know, the recording could be considered in nature part of a question. I would probably recommend that in future, if something like this is done again, the whole committee be forewarned. I don't think this should be a regular practice. It's the first time I've ever seen that done, but it would seem to be within the rules. At any rate, as a courtesy to your fellow members, I'd recommend that we be forewarned.

We probably have a couple of minutes left, Mr. Arnold. It's not much time.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

I'll give my time to Mr. Donnelly.