Evidence of meeting #128 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was vessels.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you both for appearing today.
I'll ask Ms. Dubois first. Are you aware that vessel purchasers, the new owners, are required to register the vessel with Transport Canada?
Executive Director, Ocean Legacy Foundation
Yes, I am aware that it is required. However, I can say it's still not always being done, just from being out on the coast here.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
I'll ask the same question to Ms. Bowman.
Are you aware that owners of vessels of no matter what type, on purchase, are required to register their ownership with Transport Canada?
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
Yes, I am aware of that. The issue is that the ownership is registered for a new boat with a new owner, but when the transfer of ownership happens, it doesn't always transfer over. That's the issue. It disconnects with the next owner.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
It disconnects if the new owner fails to register with Transport Canada, which is something they are required to do under current legislation and regulation.
There appears to be little enforcement or little in the way of the ability to track the resale of vessels. When a new vessel is sold by a manufacturer, there is a registration process that they have to go through. When that vessel is resold by an original or even a second- or third-generation owner, are you aware of any onus on the seller to identify to anyone that they have sold the vessel?
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
No, and I totally agree, a hundred per cent, that there is no onus for the primary owner to inform anybody that the boat has been sold. That's exactly what I was saying. We need to put that onus in place for each and every owner.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Ms. Dubois, I see you nodding your head. Please comment.
Executive Director, Ocean Legacy Foundation
Sure. I completely agree with Ms. Bowman and you.
The lack of enforcement and the disconnect between transferring ownership has to change, I think, to prevent, or at least help continue to prevent these vessels from being abandoned, as well as to enhance the tracking mechanisms that we can have available to us.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Thank you.
Ms. Bowman, I believe you said that you operated the marina for a time. How often did you see or hear of officials actually inspecting or checking for registry requirements on vessels?
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
I can say that the only time the RCMP went over to that area was when there was an issue that they needed to deal with. At no time did I see anybody go over to Dogpatch to review any of the boats in any way, shape or form. That was in 2019.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Thank you.
Mrs. Bowman, you also mentioned the serious issues of housing, mental health, addiction problems, squatting, drug use and overdoses.
Have those issues compounded over recent years?
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
Mr. Arnold, I agree. I believe it has compounded over the years, especially with our current housing crisis and increasing cost of living. More and more people are moving onto boats, because it's a shelter.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
Thank you. I have just one more quick question.
Are the people who are either squatting or occupying without permit or ownership typically people who used to have homes and vessels? Did they have a land-based home, or did they only live aboard and can they simply not afford...? Can you categorize the situation they might be in?
November 18th, 2024 / 11:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
I can't give you an actual answer to that. I don't know of any to date. I'd be curious, and I'd like to do some research on that.
Some people have never owned a house. They've only ever lived on their boat; they're live-aboards. I'm going to say that these folks here who are squatting are just like the folks we see on the streets living in tents. They were once housed and then became unhoused. For them, moving onto a boat, whether it was given to them or whether they just decided that this boat had been abandoned there for such an amount of time and they could move onto it.... It's a good question that I unfortunately don't have the answer to.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Mr. Arnold.
We'll now go to Mr. Hardie for five minutes or less, please.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
It's good to have the witnesses here.
I'll ask questions of both of you but will start with Mrs. Bowman.
Are you up to speed on the bylaws, etc., that are potential tools in the hands of municipalities to set some rules with respect to where boats are moored, how long they're allowed to stay there, etc.? This came to light because it seems that derelict and abandoned vessels are more of an issue on the west coast than anywhere else. It could be, then, that we have to get creative on the west coast as opposed to looking at pan-Canadian rules.
On those bylaws, are you aware of the abilities of the municipality in this situation?
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
I've gone to the town of Ladysmith with questions like this, and they've told me that where the boats are moored in waters, it is a provincial and federal issue, so they have no jurisdiction. I think they feel their hands are tied. I think they would like to put bylaws in place and have some ownership of this. I think that would help them—
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you, Mrs. Bowman. I have to interrupt, because my time is rather short.
Ms. Dubois, I have a question for you.
If we're going to have to deal with the residual effects of the problems that have been evident, in order to proactively deal with the future, are there things that manufacturers can do to, first of all, look at the materials they're using on the boats to make them more easily recyclable—because fibreglass, apparently, is not—and other things, like hidden vessel identification numbers, that might actually enable an owner to be tracked down? Do you have any thoughts on that?
Executive Director, Ocean Legacy Foundation
Yes, I think putting a hidden registration number in place to identify the vessel would be beneficial. However, if there is a disconnect in tracking the ownership of that vessel, we're going to continue to run into the same problems and issues.
I'm sorry. Could you repeat the first part of your question?
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
It was about the issue of what the manufacturers actually use and materials that could be more easily recycled.
Executive Director, Ocean Legacy Foundation
I think this speaks to a larger problem in terms of the disconnects in our waste management systems, but having some sort of proof of a life-cycle assessment analysis would be incredibly beneficial, so that full thought could be given from the very beginning of the construction of the vessel to, then, the disposal of the vessel.
This becomes complex, because in each community there are different capacities in terms of waste management. In British Columbia, we are pretty lucky in terms of the recycling capacities we have locally. However—
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
At that point, again, I have to interrupt. I'm sorry to do that, but my time is short.
We've had suggestions that one of the difficulties with respect to cleaning up derelict vessels is the fact that they're scattered up and down the coast, because the process and the cost of turning them in for disposal is difficult, if not expensive. Should we basically start to set up zones in which people can voluntarily surrender their vessel at no charge? At least it would make the whole issue of cleaning these vessels up easier and less expensive.
I'll ask you, Ms. Bowman.
Executive Director, Ladysmith Chamber of Commerce
Yes, I think we need to put some infrastructure in place for these boats, to help mitigate this issue and to encourage people who no longer want their boat, or whose boat is not seaworthy, to hand their vessels over in a good manner.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Getting back to you, Ms. Dubois, you mentioned the difficulties you have when it comes time to try to remove a vessel. What kind of red tape would you like to see eliminated to make that process a lot easier for you?