Evidence of meeting #63 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was problem.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Dr. Carruthers, I would ask if you could submit an answer to that in writing. That would be great.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Mr. Small has gone slightly over, and now we have to get through another couple of people before we finish off. Thank you.
We'll now go to Mr. Hardie for five minutes or less, please.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to touch on a few points. If anyone is compelled to provide more information, then, by all means, do send it in.
Ms. Carruthers, is there a chance that we could work with your brothers and sisters in the United States, who are also fishing and basically facing these same difficulties, to try to get a change in attitude in the U.S. government?
Fisheries Scientist, Fish, Food and Allied Workers Union
I think that, when fish harvester groups work together, they often come up with some excellent solutions because they are the folks who have on-the-water solutions to a given problem. I'm familiar with collaborations that have done things like solve the bycatch of turtles and stuff like that. We've been able to build off of solutions in the States and likewise here, so I don't see why we wouldn't be able to do that.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
That sounds like a recommendation in the making.
Mr. Thériault, on the U.S. position, particularly the Marine Mammal Protection Act, is this just market protection, or is it their response to all of the advocacy pressures that they're getting?
Director, Intra-Quebec Sealers Association
It's definitely activist pressure. I'm glad you're asking that question, because when you look at the bait file.... Recently, we have proven that using seals as bait would be great in all aspects. We could have better management of seals. We could use them, instead of using fish that are depleting our lobster fishing and crab fishing. It would work wonders. We would keep Canadian money in Canada. We could use local resources.
The whole thing makes sense, but the U.S. is still putting pressure on Canada to say, “No, you cannot do that.”
It really shows how we're going off the scale, but there's nothing rational about it. There's nothing scientific about it. It's all dogma-driven. I think it's high time for Canada to step up and say the MMPA doesn't make sense. Maybe it does in your land. You do whatever you want, but here in Canada, it just doesn't make sense, so stop putting that MMPA in our face for the dogmatic reason that the seals are too cute.
It doesn't make sense.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you for that, sir.
Mr. Bird, you talked about trapping and removing seals in the Columbia. Is that literally relocating a live animal someplace else?
Executive Director, Sport Fishing Institute of British Columbia
I know they have tried a number of things. Like you say, they have had—
Liberal
Executive Director, Sport Fishing Institute of British Columbia
Yes. They tried that and then they got to eliminating them.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
All right.
I need you to trade minds with the activists. What motivates them? Where do they get their information from? What do they perceive and who leads them? What do you know about these people?
Mr. Paish can answer as well if he has something to add.
Executive Director, Sport Fishing Institute of British Columbia
Do you mean as it relates to pushing back against addressing this issue we all share, or we all seem to be landing in the same place—
Executive Director, Sport Fishing Institute of British Columbia
I can't know, because I'm certainly not in that camp. I feel like I'm reasonably familiar with the issue. However, it appears that the information used by some groups is appealing to urban populations that are not familiar with the circumstances. They see a picture of an animal with big brown eyes and are compelled in that way.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Can indigenous people be better partners in an effort to change minds?
Executive Director, Sport Fishing Institute of British Columbia
I think that's an excellent avenue, and it's a very compelling argument for first nations to help share this information and have it be adopted more readily than other groups could.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Mr. Chair, we will let Ms. Desbiens and Ms. Barron take a bit of time.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you for that, Mr. Hardie.
We have about two minutes each for Ms. Desbiens and Ms. Barron, so they can split that time. I would ask them to be precise in their question. Hopefully, the answer doesn't go on for too long.
We'll go to Madam Desbiens for two minutes, please.
Bloc
Caroline Desbiens Bloc Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île dOrléans—Charlevoix, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I had actually freed up some seconds in my last round. I play fair.
Mr. Thériault, again, we're very pleased to have you with us.
In closing, could you tell us what priority action you'd like to recommend to the committee that it could include in its report?
Director, Intra-Quebec Sealers Association
Like I said earlier, it's high time that Canada challenged the MMPA, and it should do it with science. The first step is to make the seal hunt much more accessible than it is right now, keeping the regulations needed to do it properly but making it much easier for hunters. Initiatives like seal bait and shellfish harvesting should be greatly encouraged. We need to take steps very quickly if we want to preserve the fisheries in the Maritimes.
Bloc
Caroline Desbiens Bloc Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île dOrléans—Charlevoix, QC
I strongly believe that we already have successful approaches, like the one in the Magdalen Islands, where all they're trying to do is meet the demand on the Quebec market fairly.
In your opinion, shouldn't the Magdalen Islands be seen as a positive example of the restored seal hunt? Could it be used as a major promotional tool for the international market?
Director, Intra-Quebec Sealers Association
I've actually been observing a unique reality for several years. If we want to convince the international market to buy seal products, we need to use them ourselves. So we need quality products here at home, be it meat, blubber, pelts or the rest of the seal, which we can even use for bait.
I went to China in the nineties. They asked us what we were doing with seal. We said that we ate some from time to time. They offered us 25 cents a pound. Today, we're returning to China and offering them seal from a local butcher, and the packaging says it costs $80 a kilo. We're having a completely different conversation.
So I feel we must use the product to its fullest in Canada before we offer it abroad.
Thank you.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Madam Desbiens.
We'll now go to Ms. Barron to finish it off.
Director, Intra-Quebec Sealers Association
Thank you, Chair.
I have some quick questions. You had spoken about the work being taken to restore indigenous harvests of pinnipeds.
Can you expand on that a bit—on what you are seeing and the movement that's happening around that?