Evidence of meeting #23 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was area.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Since the beginning of the study, we've heard that sometimes it's about the anti-fishing of MPAs and sometimes it's about the anti-environment of MPAs. When we look at those two things, we see that it's mostly about how, where and who is going to bear the costs of proposed MPAs.
What would be the solution to make sure that everybody gets a win-win situation out of the MPAs we're trying to put in place now, in your opinion?
Operations Manager, Great Bear Sea Marine Protected Area Network, As an Individual
Through the planning process, we engaged with 15 ocean sectors to really understand their interests and what their concerns around MPAs were, and that dialogue was critical in the final plan.
The final plan, again, is a working plan to inform the regulatory process for each MPA's establishment. As we move forward, it will be really important, through that process, to do strong engagement, to do good feasibility assessments, to do good risk assessments, etc. Those are required by the regulatory process.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
I understand that, but in the mind of a fisherman, for example.... Let's say there's an MPA imposed in a certain area and that this MPA will ban fishing. In his head right now, he's thinking, “I'm not able to go fishing there. This is a loss of revenue.” An environmental group will say that in 10 years, there will be more fish in this area. However, in the meantime, who do you think should bear the cost of this loss of financial activity for the fisherman?
Operations Manager, Great Bear Sea Marine Protected Area Network, As an Individual
The goal of the process throughout was to minimize those impacts. As you can see in the socio-economic overview, we've reduced that to overall catch impacts of about 8%. The process was to minimize the impacts as much as possible.
The witness testimony from Grant Dovey and others talked about the scenario they developed and shared with us. We reduced the overall projected cost of fisheries through that process by 30% as a result of that engagement.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Are the fisheries organizations aware of what we're trying to achieve here?
Operations Manager, Great Bear Sea Marine Protected Area Network, As an Individual
Yes. As I said at the beginning, there were over 60 engagement sessions with stakeholders. When they provided us with the scenario that they developed over a year with all of their commercial fishermen, we sat down with them over six workshops to work through it, to understand it and to provide responses on where we were adjusting the network—when I say “we”, I mean the 17 first nations partners, the Government of Canada and the Province of B.C.—and where we couldn't, including the rationale for why that was not possible.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
I'm not sure if you can answer this question.
We had a witness here the last time—I think it was a group—who gave the example for geoduck fishing, saying that they were not able to fish in a certain area.
Are you aware of that? Just going out with boots and a shovel to fish geoduck.... They were not entitled to do this type of fishing. Is this true?
Operations Manager, Great Bear Sea Marine Protected Area Network, As an Individual
There are only a couple of sites within the network that have already been established. I'm not aware of any geoduck fishery that would exist within a site.
There are sites within the network that are proposed where a geoduck fishery has been identified as in conflict to the proposed conservation objective. In most cases, that is because the site is designed to protect overall biodiversity.
I should clarify that the geoduck fishery is a dive fishery that uses very high pressure, so it interrupts the benthic habitat. It's not shovels and people in boots; it's a scuba fishery with high pressure hoses that impacts the benthic habitat.
If you're trying to protect the benthic habitat, a geoduck fishery can have an impact on that.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Thank you.
Mr. Paton—quickly because I think I have only 30 seconds—you talked about an agreement that you just signed with the federal government in 2025. What is this agreement, again, please?
Assistant Executive Director, Marine and Wildlife Conservation, Qikiqtani Inuit Association
It is called the SINAA agreement. It was signed in February 2025. It looks to conserve a network of marine conservation areas of just under one million square kilometres, or what is often referred to as about 100 million hectares, across the Qikiqtani region, embedded in about six different areas across the Qikiqtani region.
Liberal
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Thank you, Mr. Cormier.
The next person to speak is Mr. Deschênes for six minutes.
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Good morning to all the witnesses. I thank them for being here to enlighten us.
My first questions are going to be for Francis Skeard from the Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation.
Mr. Skeard, you represent the Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation on the island of Newfoundland. Is that correct?
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
How did your first nation react to the announcement that the Newfoundland northeast slope would be closed and all fishing activity banned while oil and gas exploration was allowed?
Councilor, Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation
I can't speak to that, except that we fundamentally believe in a balanced approach to economic development and conservation.
I can't speak to that question, sir.
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
Okay.
In your opinion, is it a balanced approach to ban all fishing activity in a refuge, but to allow oil and gas exploration?
Councilor, Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation
If this was in the national marine conservation area on the south coast of Newfoundland that we've been working on, we would expect that oil and gas prospecting would also be eliminated from comparable areas. I can't speak to other areas, but I can speak to our traditional territory.
Is that helpful, sir?
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
Yes, it is. Thank you.
Why do you think it would be important to ban all oil and gas exploration in a marine protected area?
Councilor, Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation
In the south coast fjords national marine conservation area that we were working on until recently, oil and gas exploration and production were an exempted economic development.
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
I'm not sure I understood your answer.
Why is it important to exclude oil and gas exploration from protected areas?
Councilor, Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation
When we started the process with the national marine conservation area—the south coast fjords feasibility study—there were two or three economic development pathways that wouldn't be allowed to occur. One was oil and gas exploration. Another was minerals and another was the use of bottom-contact trawling. It was not all fishing, just bottom-contact trawling. Trawling was an exemption.
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
My question to you is, why should oil and gas exploration be excluded?
Councilor, Qalipu Mi'kmaq First Nation
If it became a feasible protected area, oil and gas were deemed to be non-conducive to a protected area of this manner.
Bloc
Alexis Deschênes Bloc Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC
Aaron Heidt, I understand that you're on the west coast and that you work on a large marine protected area.
What message do you think it sends to say that the Newfoundland northeast slope would be a refuge, but that oil and gas exploration would be allowed while all fishing activity would be banned?