Yes. I would have to say that the public service retirement rates and departure rates are fairly modest overall compared to other private sector organizations. Our overall departure rate is running at about 4%. It's fairly low compared to private sector organizations, which tend to run at 15% or 20%.
Our issue is really with the executive group. People come into the public service and enter at the bottom. They spend their entire careers in the public service and retire at the end of their careers. Of course, they are moving up, with 10% going into the executive group. A large number of people who are moving on are leaders in the public service. We're now seeing movement. They're the ones who have the knowledge. You're looking for continuity and leadership. There is an issue in terms of how we'll get new leaders. The entire renewal agenda is very much a preoccupation of the clerk.