Government Operations Committee on April 21st, 2010

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

Mr. Glémaud, you are dealing with the government here; you are not dealing with another business. Basically, all you want to know is whether you meet the program criteria. Anybody can do that by simply consulting the program website. You do not really need to submit something to the Minister's parliamentary secretary.

[Patrick Glémaud]

Madam, if you know anyone working in this area, they would certainly tell you that most consumers and most recipients have problems understanding the terms and conditions of government programs, because of the way they are written and because some of them do not even provide enough information about the funding available and the time for submitting an application.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

I would like to come back to the fact that you told your clients you had expertise in dealing with government. You worked for at least six years for the Canadian government. So, you are supposed to be familiar with the project terms and conditions.

Could you act as an interpreter for your clients? There is no real need for a submission to the parliamentary secretary, is there?

[Patrick Glémaud]

Madam, programs change. Every program has its own “terms and conditions”. If you were aware of the process, you would know that there is a memorandum to Cabinet that sets policy, that this is then presented to Parliament, which allocates the necessary budget. It then goes to Treasury Board in the form of a submission. It is based on that submission that the “terms” are set. All programs have specific terms.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

Yes, I am very much aware of that.

You say that you submitted these three summaries for your clients' businesses, without there being any benefit for your company?

[Patrick Glémaud]

They were not clients, Ms. Mendes. In order to have a client, you have to have a business relationship, a contract, an agreement, an understanding or a promise of some kind.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

So, are you telling me you did this out of the goodness of your heart?

[Patrick Glémaud]

In our line of work, we try to gather as much information as possible to see which projects might be attractive from a business perspective. If the government has programs that would be a good fit with the project, we are then able to raise money privately and go forward with the project.

For example, in the case of Ontario, solar panel programs will not exist if the Ontario government does not create appropriate programs to buy electricity. And when we approach the Government of Ontario, we want to be sure that our programs meet the “terms and conditions”, because otherwise there is no point in continuing.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

You are really getting into the whole detailed government process. I would like to ask you—both Mr. Jaffer and Mr. Clémaud—whether you could submit a list of your current and past clients, going back to April 2009—it seems that is when Mr. Jaffer became the business administrator—so that we can have a better understanding of your client base.

[Patrick Glémaud]

First of all, those relationships are confidential. Second of all, this matter is currently being debated and reviewed by the Office of the Commissioner of Lobbying. We are interested in pursuing that process and providing the necessary information to the Director of Investigations. He will make his decision based on the legislation.

If this Committee decides to remove the authority of the Commissioner and withdraw the Lobbying Act, at that point, you will replace them and we will answer. But so far--

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

You are confirming, then, that you received no payment for a submission you made to government.

[Patrick Glémaud]

Absolutely none.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

I am talking about payment from your client; I am not talking about the government, obviously. I am talking about the client. You received no payment--

[Patrick Glémaud]

We have received nothing from any client, Madam. We can swear on the bible, or whatever else you may like, that we have received no payment and no compensation from anyone for lobbying activities.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—La Prairie, QC]

I have one last question for you, Mr. Jaffer. Are you able to share your opinion on the way the Prime Minister managed this affair, particularly as it concerns your wife, Ms. Guergis?

[Rahim Jaffer]

That's not within the scope of our study here today, so I don't see the relevance, Madam Chair, of responding to that question. I understand and I hope that the matter will be cleared up shortly by those authorities who are looking at this whole matter. I'm certain it will be, and I'm certain that my wife will clear her name and be back in Parliament with her caucus and colleagues soon.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you, Madame Mendes.

We now go to Monsieur Nadeau, pour cinq minutes, s'il vous plaît.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, gentlemen.

As far as I know, Mr. Glémaud, you were a candidate in the last federal election, were you not?

[Patrick Glémaud]

Yes, and based on the attacks against me in recent weeks, I have the impression that my only crime, in the view of some people, is that I was a candidate for the Conservative Party.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I understand that you are not yet a member of Parliament, but you must still follow procedure. When we address questions to Mr. Jaffer, you must let him answer; he is capable of answering on his own. Do not take offence at the questions; simply let the process take its course.

[Patrick Glémaud]

The question was addressed to me, Mr. Nadeau.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Mr. Jaffer, of everything that we have been hearing in the last little while, one thing greatly surprises me. It looks as though your business survived on nothing more than fresh air and that you were content to collect information. But, to collect information to do what with it, exactly? Did you give it to other companies? Did you sell it to other companies? Did you use it for a specific purpose, such as to benefit other companies or try to secure contracts with the federal government? What did you do with that information?

[Rahim Jaffer]

As I mentioned, we have a bigger goal for our company, and that is to take many new technologies to new markets. That's where we would like to go. In the process, if we can help them direct themselves to where they may want to look for help at any government level, whether provincial or federal, we direct them in that direction. Then it's up to them to make contact with the appropriate officials or departments or programs to carry on with the process, if they would like to secure any form of government aid. That's not the basis of our—

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

So, the idea was to gather specific information related to areas of expertise, which Mr. Glémaud talked about a few minutes ago, for businesses that could benefit from knowing more about the workings of the federal government, the main players and the programs it delivers. Is that correct?

[Rahim Jaffer]

Most of this information is made public through government websites or various other departments. Often, many of the people we are working with either don't have government affairs.... They are newer companies with new technologies and don't understand how to go about finding information. So what we do is gather it for them and give it to them, with the goal of looking at working with them in a different capacity. What they wish to do with that information is their choice.