Government Operations Committee on May 8th, 2018

[Rodney Ghali]

It's a whole-of-government approach in terms of—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

That's not my question. Who specifically said to put the budget being balanced as “underway with challenges”?

[Rodney Ghali]

It's the Department of Finance that provides the information that we load on the website.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Perfect, that was my question.

Do you not feel bad that you're given wrong information? This is your website, and it reflects on your department. Do you not feel awkward, putting up what's basically a lie?

[Rodney Ghali]

We provide the best information we have to Canadians, which is supplied from departments and agencies.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

I have a couple of quick questions.

On page 17 of your DP, you note that there is going to be a future decrease in funding for GIC appointments. We've been falling far behind on GIC appointments. Do you see us being caught up by that point, which allows you to decrease the funding?

[Matthew Shea]

Let me just find that.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Okay. While you're finding that, let me go to another question, because we're short on time.

On page 8 of your DP, there's a comment that PCO “supports the development and maintenance of a high performing Public Service” and fostering a healthy workplace. This committee did an incredible job on updating the whistle-blower act, and there was unanimous agreement on the recommendations, on which the government has not followed through.

How do you feel when your mandate, stated right in your own departmental plan, is “the development and maintenance of a high performing Public Service” and fostering a healthy workplace, when we've done nothing to update the whistle-blower act? It prevents abuse and harassment of public servants, which, if you've read the various departments' staffing surveys, ranks very high as an issue, as high as 45% or 55%.

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Once again, you have very little time to respond.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Answer the last one. Forget about page 17. Answer the whistle-blower issue.

[Matthew Shea]

Your question relates to the public service employee survey and the harassment numbers in general.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

No, your mandate, your DP, talks about fostering a healthy workplace, and the other issue about high performance. How does that reflect the fact that the government hasn't acted on the whistle-blower recommendations to protect public servants?

[Matthew Shea]

I'll focus on our role in fostering a high-performing workforce and—

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Please do so very quickly.

[Matthew Shea]

The clerk, as head of the public service, has taken actions around harassment. He has put together a DM task force that's looking at ways we can improve the workplace. In addition, he has asked all deputy heads to make sure that their internal processes are up to date and that employees know what avenues are available to them when they have a complaint, when they're facing those issues. Recently, he gave an interview and talked about this being one of his top priorities.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

We're probably out of time. I will only say this. If you really wish to further foster a healthy workplace, follow up on the whistle-blower issue. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

We'll go Madam Ratansi for the final intervention of five minutes.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Thank you very much. I'm going to continue in that vein.

The impact Canada initiative is trying to create a renewal and modernization of the public service. You talked about a commitment to the advancement of a healthy workplace and promotion of diversity. Could you explain that a bit more? When there are just words, we do not know exactly what you are doing.

I'll give you my second question now so that you have enough time to answer. Your departmental plan talks about “[e]nsuring that all proposals to the Cabinet and its Committees are comprehensive and have included considerations for Gender-based Analysis Plus”. As we look at the public service, we do not see too much diversity in the upper echelons, and we do not see too many women.

Could you answer those questions? It's five minutes, and now you have the time to answer both my questions. Thank you.

[Rodney Ghali]

I'll start by responding to the first part of your questions, about the impact Canada initiative and how that relates to the renewal and transformation of the public service with respect to bringing in new tools, approaches, and skill sets. Within my organization, we're undertaking an innovative staffing model where we're looking at targeting talent from the outside in very specific areas that we feel are under-serviced within the current public service.

We are looking at new tools and approaches, such as behavioural insight, innovative financing, impact measurement, and data science. These are all tools and approaches that are needed within a modern workforce to execute the agenda of the day and, certainly, to respond to the needs of the citizens. We have been very aggressively recruiting over the last several months to bring these skill sets within the Privy Council Office, but also to deploy them elsewhere in departments and agencies that are delivering on the programs and services directly to Canadians.

That's all part and parcel of a whole-of-government approach, again, in how we are up-skilling the public service and bringing in those innovative ideas.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

What about harassment and bullying? I think I'm taking it from there. That's a big problem within the public service. How are you addressing that?

[Rodney Ghali]

Do you want to finish that?

[Matthew Shea]

I think it's less related to the impact Canada initiative and more to the public service leadership. As I started to say, there's a DM committee that's working on this. There's a bill before the House to address some of the harassment issues that exist and give new tools to individuals who feel harassed. This is put within people's performance agreements to help create a healthy work environment.

Across the government, we've seen many departments investing money in training and ensuring that this is a priority of the government. We hear the clerk talk about it often, whether it be in the clerk's report on the public service or in interviews he does. Recently, a number of us attended an ADM forum, and the clerk talked about bullying and the importance of our trying to root it out of the public service. It's something the public service is seized with and focused on, and there is work under way to advance that.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Hopefully the whistle-blower legislation will be implemented and explained to people.

From a gender perspective, what sort of tools are you giving to departments? What is your role in ensuring that the gender-based analysis is done properly? Everybody can talk about gender-based analysis, but there are things that people don't understand.

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

The Privy Council Office has a role in two main areas. The first is providing the framework and guidance for developing memoranda to cabinet, which include a gender-based analysis component. The Privy Council Office, working with Status of Women, has informed how that gender-based analysis should be undertaken.

In applying its challenge function to the policy development process, the Privy Council Office also provides guidance and questions to departments as that policy development analysis is under way. At the Privy Council Office, we have a very high rate of completion on gender-based analysis training.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Okay, thanks.