Evidence of meeting #43 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was service.
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
In a city like Edmonton, how much does it spend per year on enforcement of municipal bylaws?
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
How much do you spend on training for city workers to enforce the bylaws?
9 a.m.
Councillor, City of Edmonton
Our budget is $2.6 billion, and we have 13,000 employees. I'm always looking for efficiencies, but remember that when we look for efficiencies, it's about metrics, targets, and outcomes. What's the outcome we want to achieve, what's the target to get there, and how do we know if we're moving the needle? That's why I always encourage pilots first and try to open the ears for other organizations. We have a culture problem here between the orders of government, and trying to breach it has always been the problem.
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
You also talked about better service models and management working with employees to generate profitability.
When you look at Canada Post, and from what you've heard in the media and maybe your experiences with them as a business person, do you feel that the current management is capable of delivering on a vision on expansion of service? They've been in a contraction mode now for quite some time.
9 a.m.
Councillor, City of Edmonton
You can't answer that until you address the accounting issues. I talked about those metrics and targets. Then there has to be a culture change on the question of outcome. What do you want to do? Do you want to continue contraction, or do you want to really take a look at this value-added aspect of it and start saying to other orders of government, “You know what? We might be able to help your business model and drive efficiencies.”
As people know in this region, I'm pretty hard on management. I always have been and I always will be. We can always do better, because I never blame the guy pushing the broom in my shop. I blame the supervisor telling him where to push the broom. That's the problem.
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Okay.
What types of services do you think the Canada Post real estate can offer that aren't already being serviced in the Edmonton community?
9 a.m.
Councillor, City of Edmonton
It ranges to everything from basic financial access to a simple bank account of some sort, all the way up to a range of social services. I strongly believe that the front-line desk worker can put those people into a stream on the social service side that would get them the help they need.
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
—different orders of government would trust Canada Post to provide that service on behalf of federal departments?
9 a.m.
Councillor, City of Edmonton
It's a matter of training and it's a matter of monitoring. It's back to metrics, targets, and outcomes.
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Ms. Kennedy, very briefly, on the pension side, I guess you have some experience with it. What is your feeling about having a jointly managed union-management pension plan that the union would then take some ownership of so that it could be managed on a going concern basis rather than an insolvency basis? Are there different ways to uncouple the pension risk from the operational and the biennial negotiations on labour?
9 a.m.
As an Individual
I've looked at that briefly in some of the submissions that have been made already to you and that you've had from people who are experts in that area. I think the joint ownership and the management of the pension would be a huge change. Right now, it's 100%.
I did sit as an alternate on the pension advisory council, so I was at some of those meetings with Canada Post in Ottawa, and the decisions are entirely made by Canada Post. With the financial advisers, the people who are running all the accounts, and where the investments are made, that is all decided completely by Canada Post. If there is a mistake made and money is lost, then the union can ask questions at the council meeting and they can provide suggestions, but that's as far as it goes.
In order for the union to be a joint owner of the plan, there would be a complete restructuring of the way it's set up at this time. The liability right now sits 100% with the employer and the Government of Canada. It's under—
9 a.m.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Would you think the union would be amenable to taking some joint risk?
9 a.m.
As an Individual
I think no one is going to say, “We're not going to consider anything”. I'm retired from the union. I've been gone for two years, but having been there and having seen the types of discussions that were taking place, I don't think anyone is going to say, “We're not even going to discuss that”. They will look at it. I think everyone wants to see the pension plan continue and be healthy, and the commitment has been made.
I can remember when Moya Greene came through Edmonton talking about hiring an employee as a 30-year commitment. It is, because you've made a commitment. You contribute half and half to the pension fund, and you know that in the future you're going to be drawing that for the rest of your life. It's a very important decision here, and it's critical to many people.
9 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Tom Lukiwski
Thank you very much.
We're now going to our final two interventions, which will be five minutes each.
We'll start with Mr. McCauley, for five minutes, please.
9 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
Thanks for joining us today.
Councillor Nickel, it's a pleasure to have you.
9 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
For those who aren't aware, Mr. Nickel obviously is a devoted servant to the people of Edmonton, and he is one of a group of people who helped save our beloved Oilers during the 1990s recession. We wouldn't have our new arena without Mr. Nickel and some of his friends from way back with their vision, so thanks very much for that, unless they lose, in which case I blame you.
9 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
You've talked about the idea of postal workers reporting issues. We've heard it from other people and it's almost utopian. They can be there and everywhere and report the potholes, this and that, and they can report where the photo radar vans are in town. Do you think this city and its workers are going to give up control, or give up their jobs and pass them over to...? You talked about how someone has to pay for this, which is going to come out of strained city finances.
9 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
Do you think it's practical to think cities across the.... Look at Montreal, do you think les bleus are going to give up their jobs?
9 a.m.
Councillor, City of Edmonton
Mr. McCauley, it is not a question of replacing city workers. It's a question of not having enough boots on the street. It is a question of value adding with somebody who's already there and reducing the transactional costs of having to hire more people for the city to enforce the bylaws, to check out the infrastructure, and to do all of those things, even for the police department. I bet, for example, the postal worker knows where the drug houses are before the police do.