You're right. The situation is still the same. There are no real issues as far as attracting individuals to come to work for the federal public service. The problem is keeping them here for a long time, for a full career. What we have to realize and live with is that we have to change the way we manage our resources. What we see is that the people who are coming in are not necessarily going to stay for 30 or 35 years in the public service, and not for bad reasons or good reasons. That's the way it is. They want different challenges and so on. What we need to do, I think, is to find a mechanism so that people can leave and come back easily to the public service, which does not exist right now. Right now, if you want to go, there are programs that exist, but they are complicated. They take a lot of work, a lot of effort.
We have to find a way that, if an individual wants to go for good reasons to the private sector, or a provincial government, or anywhere else, then they can go, come back easily to continue their career with us, bring that experience, and at the same time, not be penalized for all the benefits that they might lose over the few years.
This is one way of trying to retain. We have to change our mindset. We cannot just hire the way we did and think that people will just stay with the organization because it's a great place to work and so on. We have to do a little bit more.