Government Operations Committee on Aug. 27th, 2024

[Thomas Aabo]

During the process of selecting, sourcing, visiting and reviewing 39 properties and narrowing those down to 21, four, two and one, I did not meet with anyone from Mr. Clark's office. Once the selection had been made, several individuals from the mission, including Mr. Clark, came to tour the property as part of, I believe, a final vetting of some sort, but this was after the decision had already been made that they were going to proceed with that property.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thanks for that.

Turning to the former property that Global Affairs owns and has listed on the market, are you familiar with that property?

[Thomas Aabo]

Yes, I am familiar with it.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Perhaps this is a question for Mr. Miller, who's a bit less closely tied to these transactions.

The property is currently listed at $13 million, a price at which Global Affairs and the Government of Canada would realize a profit, yet we see with the newly acquired property that the asking price had to be reduced by about 40% before the property sold. Is $13 million a reasonable asking price in your approximation, or would you expect that it would sell for considerably less than that?

[Jonathan Miller]

As a licensed and certified appraiser, because I have not looked at the specifics of the property but only the market that it sits within, I'm unable to answer your question professionally.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Can you provide any sort of comment on the amount below the asking price that properties like this are typically selling for percentage-wise, or is it all over the map?

[Jonathan Miller]

On average, in the Park Avenue market, we're talking somewhere between 5% and 10% below the original ask if it's priced correctly.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Those are all the questions I have, Mr. Chair. I'll turn it back to you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you very much. You're right on time.

Mrs. Block, go ahead, please.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you very much, Chair. I will be splitting my time with my colleague Mrs. Kusie.

Mr. Aabo, you mentioned in your opening remarks and again in one of your most recent responses that there was an initial list of 39 properties. Can you table that list with the committee and include the locations and prices, please?

[Thomas Aabo]

We'd be happy to.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you very much.

Quickly, I'm going to follow up on a couple of lines of questioning by a couple of my colleagues.

Mr. Aabo, I thought I heard you say that you were made aware by GAC of the need for renovations, but not to the extent that they have indicated to the committee. Can you tell me what the impact on the sale price of a unit would be knowing that there are significant repairs needed?

[Thomas Aabo]

The easy way to answer the question is that, as you tour a new property, depending on the requirements of the buyer, those repairs will either be important or less important, depending on the final use of the property. In the specific case of 550 Park Avenue, the pricing that has been set went through a very rigorous process that we always apply to any residence that's being posted for sale. Included in that consideration is the potential need for repairs, to be decided by the final purchaser, of course.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Really quickly, the price included what GAC indicated as a need for $2.6 million in repairs. The price set for that unit reflects that.

[Thomas Aabo]

The price set for the unit reflects that there is a potential for what we call upgrades to the unit.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you very much.

My first question is for either witness.

Do either of the witnesses have knowledge as to where the current Canadian representative to the United Nations resides?

[Thomas Aabo]

I can answer that question. I do have knowledge.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Please go ahead.

[Thomas Aabo]

Should I share where he resides?

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Please.

[Thomas Aabo]

Okay. Is that public information? I'm not sure.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

If it's the same information that I have, it's that he currently resides in the Park Avenue residence, the same building as the former residence of the consul general. This is my understanding.

I'm seeing you nod. It seems that you're in agreement. That's very interesting to me.

Does the current Canadian representative to the United Nations have any plans to sell this residence, to leave this building and find another residence? Are you aware of that?

[Thomas Aabo]

I believe that's an answer best provided by Global Affairs. I am not aware of a current plan to dispose of it.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

It's very interesting to me that this previous residence was not good enough for the consul general, yet somehow it remains good enough for the Canadian representative to the United Nations. There seems to be some type of disconnect, that this residence is good enough for one Canadian representative in NYC but not good enough for the consul general. It's very interesting.

Mr. Chair, I'm going to summarize by saying how very disappointed I am in this government for not seeing value for money for Canadians compared to the Harper government. The Harper government sold the Dublin residence for $10 million. We sold the entire Hong Kong mission for $86 million in 2016. We sold Macdonald house for $530 million—this was above the asking price—and unified two buildings in purchasing the house next to Canada House, for a savings of $250 million. Finally, I'll note that we listed Coral Gables, the official residence in Miami, a residence I have visited, for $5.2 million.

In closing, I'll say that under the previous administration, the Harper government, we sold more than 80 diplomatic properties for more than $720 million. This is the type of value for money that Canadians deserve, and Liberals should come to understand this.

Thank you very much.